Since the casting failure probablity is not more than 50%, the game's developers have decided not to add a miscast icon to the spell. It's intentional (not a bug). However, you actually do have an indication in the combat text and that is the very fact that you read that an Unholy Word spell is cast; so you already know that there is a 50% chance of casting failure. In short, I don't think that there is anything in need of fixing here.



The spell is working as intended (no bug); however, the behavior of those mad spellcasters is entirely revised in IA v6. You won't have any problem with their choice of spells anymore.

My personal opinion is that the spell's effect should be indicated with the proper 'deafened' icon on the character's portrait. This is what should be fixed. Besides, why do enemy Planetars have Unholy Word while my own don't have it?

Ye there's a little deafened icon you get with the level two spell to indicate 50% spell failure that unholy word probably should have.

It's annoying because you have to guess when the spell failure effect has ran out at the moment.

they got holy word instead, right?

cos they are the good boys.

Yes, of course I meant that my (dark) planetars should have (Un)Holy word as well, much like the enemy ones have it.

Yours have it as well. The fallen planatar summoned by enemies is completely identical with the one summoned by PCs. But Unholy Word won't be of much use to you; you don't encounter many good aligned enemies.

Adding a deafened icon to the Unholy Word spell is not a bad idea (though if we decide to implement it, it should be called a tweak rather than a fix). Will consider it.

EDIT: Considered the suggestion to add deafness icon to Unholy Word and decided not to implement it. A degree of uncertainty regarding its duration is a nice add-on as an additional challenge, specially because the enemies who use Unholy Word are really rare. Moreover, a tactician should be able to (approximately) reckon the duration by counting rounds.

It's done as you can now read in the progress report for IA v6. Random creatures who spawn during the party's rest are replaced with new and separate versions of those creatures who not only give no xp but also carry no treasure. Moreover, there are certain spawn-points in the vanilla game in which the same creatures re-spawn infinitely if you revisit the area (even if you have already cleared the area). Those monsters are also changed in the same way.

Problem is that it is absolutely unrealistic. You (I mean your character) is deaf. You do not hear anything. Do you think that it remains unnoticed when you suddenly start to hear noises? A battle is very noisy and I think my characters are clever enough to realize that they are able to hear that awful noise.

I do not like those types of difficulties when you are not aware of what your characters know for sure. Decision is up to you, I just suggest to you to reconsider and add that icon.

Another pseudo-challenge?

Seriously though it's like Vuki said: the character is deaf. He should be aware of it. Especially when considering the chance to make any mistakes when casting a spell due to the deafness. Thus the appropriate icon should be displayed in the character record. Actually if affected by the spell Deafness this is what happens. Thus I think it's quite strange if a character's deafness can only be seen on the character record if he's by the spell of the same name. From my point of view it's more a fix rather than anything else. Btw, do these two deafness effects stack with each other? If so that should be fixed as well. You can't get deafer than deaf.

A skilled player doesn't always and necessarily need portrait icons to realize what is going on in his game.

Of course, as I said before, adding a deafness icon is not a bad idea, but it's not a necessary tweak, specially because the lack of the icon seems to me to be something probably intended by the game's developers. Moreover, I like the lack of this particular icon as an additional challenge for testing my accuracy in counting rounds and reckoning when the deafness is ended.

The decision about this issue is already made. Let's move on to work on other things. Thanks.

I have observed a bug with dispel magic.

It seems dispel magic cast on the party by party members does not properly dispel higher level effects. Lower level effects seem to be removed some of the time as it should be but higher level effects are never removed (1%?). A +1 caster level effect should be removed 40% of the time. On its own this bug doesn't seem significant, but it may reveal other issues with dispel.

To repeat my test start a new game with a mage protagonist that knows shield and dispel magic. Have Imoen (L8 sorc) and the protagonist (L7 mage) cast shield. When the protagonist casts dispel magic on the party it seems that his own shield is removed about 50% of the time, while Imoen's shield is never removed.

I have attached a copy of my WeiDU.log.

Since this is a report of a possible bug in the vanilla game and has nothing to do with IA, I moved it from IA bug thread to the relevant topic here.

At some opportunity, I will ask one of my testers to test this; but even if such a bug exists in the game, there is nothing we can do about it; so, let's just hope that there is no such bug and dispel magic works as its description says.

I've just tested this with a vanilla game setup (clean install as per the recommended setup EXCEPT IA). I created a multiplayer game with a custom Necromancer and a custom sorcerer, bumped the sorcerer's XP up using Shadowkeeper.

The test:
- Necromancer at level 7, sorcerer at level 8
- Both would cast Shield
- Necromancer would cast Dispel Magic

Results (51 times, as a level 7 Necromancer has 3 level 3 spell slots):
Necromancer's Shield dispelled 21 times, Sorcerer's Shield not dispelled at all.

Either I was extremely unlucky or the probability is really wrong.

@Sikret:

Please PM me if you need me to conduct more tests using a vanilla game setup.

EDIT:

More results.

Using the same test, The Necromancer's Shield was dispelled 27 times out of 51 tries, whilst the Sorcerer's Shield was not dispelled at all.


I also tried the reverse out: using the level 8 Sorcerer to dispel the Shields (level 8 Sorcerer's can cast level 3 spells 5 times).

First 50 times: Sorcerer's Shield dispelled 17 times, Necromancer's Shield dispelled 26 times.
Second set of 50: Sorcerer's Shield dispelled 27 times, Necromancer's Shield dispelled 29 times.

I'm not sure it's a problem with the probability, I think it could be a problem with sorcerers - there are similar problems when a sorcerer in the party casts a spell like Spell Turning/Spell Trap and then someone else in the party casts single-target spells at them - namely that the spell protection does not seem to be depleted properly.

Try making two mages (not sorcerers) of comparable levels and repeat the test, have one cast Shield and the other cast the Dispel. Then try with two sorcerers.


EDIT: LZJ your last test seems to be consistent with the idea that the caster (in this case, the sorcerer) can always affect their own spells with Dispel Magic as normal.

Following what Raven said, I've just tested this with 2 Necromancers.

The lvl 7 Necromancer attempting to dispel the Shields of both:
51 times: Lvl 7 Necromancer's Shield dispelled 23 times, Lvl 8 Necromancer's Shield not dispelled at all.

As can be seen, the problem still exists where both are mages (as opposed to a mage and a sorcerer).

I'll be testing this with 2 Sorcerers very soon.

EDIT:

Tested it with 2 Sorcerers, one level 7 and the other level 8, with the level 7 Sorcerer casting the Dispel.
Out of 52 Times: Lvl 7 Sorcerer's Shield dispelled 21 times, Lvl 8 Sorcerer's Shield not dispelled at all.

Conclusion: high probability that there's a bug with the Dispel Magic.

Hmm it looks like there is some problem with Dispel Magic. Like Sikret said though, probably nothing can be done about it. As long as Dispel and Remove Magic work ok when one of the casters involved is an enemy, it's not so big a problem.

Contingency still triggered on some very particular enemy mages' corpses. I only encountered this with Harpers (one of them is named Jeremon the other's name escapes me) from Jaheira romance, they might possibly be overlooked. It's no big deal but still..

Will check and fix. Thanks!

I didn't notice that until recently but as far as i can see the sequencers do not work the way they are intended to. For instance today Lavok triggered a sequencer at me loaded with (Remove Magic+Malison+Slow), but it affected me in exactly reverse order, that is, first i saved against slow, then my saving throws are lowered, then i got dispelled. I hadn't notice that since i generally load sequencers with spells that have same effects (more or less) like 3xRemove Magic or 3xEmotion etc.

So while loading sequencers one should also take into account the projectile speed of spells which is impossible to determine. Moreover, even when the order is changed, the effects are still applied in meaningless orders. I ran some tests with the above combo(i have screenshots too);

Remove+Malison+Slow => Slow+Malison+Remove
Remove+Slow+Malison => Slow+Remove+Malison
Slow+Malison+Remove => Slow+Remove+Malison
Slow+Remove+Malison => Slow+Remove+Malison
Malison+Remove+Slow => Slow+Remove+Malison
Malison+Slow+Remove => Slow+Remove+Malison

How is it even possible that for only one order the effects are applied differently? And is this problem even fixable?

ps I don't know if this is related to IA or vanilla game so i posted it here

The description for the 7th level priest spell 'Resurrection' says that the casting time is 1 turn, I think it should be 1 round (1 turn = 10 rounds = 1 minute, right?).

Also same for Druid spell Call lightning.

Don't know if anybody already listed this...

If you drain levels from draconus, he becomes invincible. At near death, his initial dialogue is repeated instead of changing into his dragon form, and he stays at near death, surviving infinite damage. I had to reload a couple of times until I unequipped Sword of Mask. (purely on conjecture, but it turns out that was actually the problem)

Draconis is immune to level drain in his human form, in both IA and the vanilla game. If he is not transitioning into dragon form there is surely some other reason.

This may or may not be a bug, but I believe it is (not a big one anyway) - Sendai's helmet (Wong Fei's Ioun Stone) is said to be usable by: Monk, Fighter, Kensai. Dual-classed fighters can use it, but multiclasses can not. Yet, a fighter/mage/cleric can.

Hi,

Not really a bug, more an annoyance, and not sure whether it's vanilla game issue or IA, but when your berseker is enraged (protected from level drain among other things), you still have message "5 level drain" on your feedback (while levels are not drained on character sheet).
This happend to me while fighting Orcus, didn't notice on other fights.

(I just have classical IA install, no other mod)

Yeah it is just a cosmetic issue of the vanilla Enrage - it's easy enough to fix the ability to disable the 'x levels drained' strings, I'm sure Sikret will do it when he gets a chance. Thanks.

Vanilla bug is that levels should be drained. Berserkers enrage should not protect from level drain. Ability description says nothing about protection from level drain, afaik.

thanks for answer.

@matti: didn't notice that, reading some threads here I thought it granted that rage protects against level drain.

I seldom play with bersekers (and never did once without IA installed)

matti I see your point; AFAIK in IA Enrage *is* supposed to protection from Level Drain and consequently *is* supposed to disable the 'x levels drained' strings.

Done!

Don't know if anybody already listed this...

Some beholders(Gauth and the beholder worthing 9000XP, maybe others) can fire their eyestalks even when unconsious. Interestingly, they dont do this when feared or confused...

Yes, it's a vanilla game bug which has been fixed in IA v6.

I saw this mentioned in post #186, but there was no follow up.

Are there any plans to include a Shapeshifter fix in an upcoming version of IA? The readme warns not to install Weimer's version of Shapeshifter Rebalancing because it's overpowered. However the fact still remains that the original Shapeshifter class had some problems. The statistics of the werewolf and greater werewolf forms were nerfed from what you were supposed to get, and the werewolf paws could be dispelled (which also happens if you save & reload). Weimer's version fixed the stats and dispel bug, but introduced what some players felt was an inappropriate way of shapeshifting, and one that came with its own share of exploits.

The Refinements mod (whose HLA tables would likely create incompatibilities with IA) had another idea. It fixed the statistics and made it where the paws, if dispelled, would return at the end of the round. However, for some reason, it also made it where shapeshifting stunned your character, which could very easily get you killed.

On SHS one user created a new variation which got rid of the stun, fixed the animations, and made the paws undispellable. The problem was that you were immune to Dispel Magic. Plus it's still beta, and I don't know if the guy has touched it since. (I can't even figure out how to test this fix, mind you.)


I'd like to see IA address this issue in its own right. It looks like a lot of work and consideration was already put into other classes, especially rangers.

Here are my suggestions. In addition to fixing the stats and the dispel bug, scale the resistances of the werewolf forms so that it's not one huge leap at level 13. Perhaps the STR/DEX/CON bonuses and elemental resistances gradually improve with level, and the werewolf form doesn't grant immunity to normal weapons until level 10. Also, I know it's reminiscent of Weimer's overpowered version, but I'd still suggest an option for spellcasting in the form of a HLA. (Spellcasting shapeshifters weren't in PnP, but then neither were HLA's.) I don't think it would overpower the class if it's a HLA; perhaps it would be the last in the line of a tiered set of abilities. Priest spells do tend to have long casting times regardless (Bless, Chant, Call Lightning, Iron Skins, etc.) and I've found that while my shapeshifter is standing there casting a spell, she's certainly not able to beat up enemies.

I know this is a lot to ask, but I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention it.

SPOILER!

Yes, that is a known bug of the vanilla game. First of all, note that abusing this bug is plain cheat and no serious player should even think of it.

We did consider a possible method to fix it, but it required a huge amount of work and it wouldn't lead to a perfect solution in the end; so, we decided to leave it at least for now.

This isnt a bug, but more of an lame exploit you might want to fix for v6. Idunno if anybody would go through the trouble to do it, but here it is anyways...

You can get free xp in shadow temple by sending out skeleton warriors to various spots of the map covered by fog of war. Then go watch tv or something and the skeleton warriors will farm those little shades respawning infinitely for 8 hours; The skeletons are completely immune to the shades' damage. It would net about a million xp per hour while you're away from your computer.

All such and similar exploits have already been fixed in v6. See the Progress Report for IA v6. Quote:


It took us ages to detect, fix, and test the big number of such possible exploits in the game, but we did it.

I am pretty sure that everybody noticed it already but it is still worth to mention it. Description of Greater Restoration and the effect of it is really different. The spell description says that it affects the target but in reality it affects the whole party. This discrepancy should be resolved imho.

Another real bug in the game is that even if you buy restoration in a temple your character still will be fatigued. The spell causes this effect to the caster and not to the target of the spell (unless it is the same person of course) and in the current case the caster is a priest of the temple.

In the 2nd level of the Maze under Spellhold there is a small bug. You can enter to the room of the djinni (where you need the painting) without opening the door. If you click on the right bottom of the cell then the character can walk to the cell (it is in the following area: from x=1800, y=530 to x=1890, y= 470).

I don't know if this a bug however since it is changed for Skullcrusher mace: Equalizer bonus vs Aligments applies to main hand wpn also (if Equalizer is used off hand)

A few discoveries I've made, my apologies if they've been mentioned already:

-Cromwell's upgrade description of Lilarcor/warblade says it gives +2 to strength/dexterity/constitution, which doesn't match the readme or result

-Neutralize poison (4th level cleric spell) cast from a scroll does not remove Neo Otugyh (sp?) disease though it says it will in the description. haven't checked the actual spell.

-script error in Teshal's fight - I tried it in Ch2/3 with my current group, and while I managed to kill the skeleton lords and gated bone golems, everyone in my group eventually succumbed to the barrage of greater commands and were lying unconcious with a group of skeleton warriors (summoned) and teshal standing around not attacking instead of chopping me to pieces.

I don't have access to v5 files at the moment to check these two problems, but neither of them exist in v6. Perhaps they had been reported and fixed before.



This is an engine limitation (doesn't have anything to do with IA). Sometimes enemies just don't see unconscious targets, sometimes they do.

PS: All three cases were vanilla game issues (not related to IA); so the post and my answer are both moved to the vanilla game bug reports thread.

I think (dredging up dim memories of having the same problem) it's more a script language problem than an engine problem. You can get around it by telling monsters that if they can't see anything hostile but they can see Player1, attack Player1. (And repeat for Player2-Player6). IF See(Player1) THEN RESPONSE #100 Attack(Player1) END works (iirc) irrespective of Player1's state.

In my IA v5 game, I was observing this issue. Even with the See(NearestEnemyOf(Myself)), enemies sometimes managed to see unconscious targets and sometimes failed to see them. That's why I thought that it might be an engine problem. Actually, the frequency of cases they managed to see the unconscious targets was more than cases in which they failed to see them. Perhaps, there is a more subtle explanation for the phenomenon. All in all, I prefer to let it pass, as it's not a highly probable or frequent event to have ALL party members lying unconscious in the battlefield.

I would actually prioritize unconscious characters because they have no defenses... or is that just me.

This is one way of looking at it. The alternate view is that the unconscious character is not an active threat and is not a priority. For example, I will certainly try to attack an active mage who is casting spells on me rather than the mage's friend who is napping on the ground.

Admittedly, it depends on the situation. For example, attacking a 20th level unconscious target has higher priority than attacking a 1st level active target. There are a lot of factors involved and this is an example of where a human mind is superior to artificial intelligence (A.I.).

To be honest, I'm not sure. I think I did at one point find necessary & sufficient conditions for See(NearestEnemyOf(Myself)) to fire, but I may be misremembering. (Once I found See(PlayerX) always worked, the problem became fairly academic.)



Fair enough. It happens a bit more often in BG1 situations, where spells like Sleep are effective against low-level parties - I think that's where I discovered the problem, in fact.

I did some more comprehensive tests on this issue and now I'm quite convinced that there is some engine problem involved in this case and the See(NearestEnemyOf(Myself)) trigger is not to be blamed. When the entire party are unconscious, enemy behavior is quite random; sometimes (actually most of the times) they see unconscious party members and sometimes they don't see them.

In general, the enemies seem to have a better chance to see the protagonist (than other party members) while unconscious (this may be due to the fact that they seek player1 when failing to see anyone). So, it seems that adding See(Playerx) triggers doesn't look necessary or worth the trouble, because player1 is mostly seen and attacked anyway.

I tried to figure out some general rules, but each and every theory was falsified by counter examples in further tests. Whether (or not) the enemy sees an unconscious target looks to be random. Fortunately, this is not a big deal, because as I said before, the cases in which the entire party are lying unconscious on the ground are quite rare and improbable (actually, I had to try hard everytime to prepare that situation for my tests).

Hi Sikret!

I think more of engine limitations as hardcoded but I think we are limited in the IDS files to an extent.

StateCheck(Player1,STATE_HELPLESS) which is the state the Emotion spell causes and this is just a simple check. This would mean adding more and more script blocks to your enemies' BCS to account for the multiple disabling states and then the enemies attack reevaluation. Then to make sure they do checks for all six party member. Also the reverse would have to be considered as well as an opposite block !StateCheck(....).

In my opinion, this approach does give an added sense of smarter enemy AI (or in party AI scripting) but it can create very bloated scripts that can cause some instability if things don't work right. On the other hand it may be something you choose for more specific enemy types or characters and not every single combatant. For example, an enemy golem or enemy troll may not be as choosy as an enemy fighter or spellcaster.

Some mods I have seen append to STATE.IDS and make a more cumulative state check of STATE_DISABLED so that cuts down on the multiple state checks for stunned, sleeping, confused, etc. Still it is not limiting in my opinion, just a lot more scripting language to use as DavidW pointed out.

Then again if the whole party is disabled then it is game over

Good luck with the finishing touches on IA6

Checking states is already comprehensively used in scripts; they do work properly, but it is not relevant to the discussed issue above. The question was to find necessary and sufficient conditions for See(NearestEnemyOf(Myself)) trigger to turn true and this is what seems to be working quite randomly with no general rules. I did many tests and it seems that when the entire party are unconscious, whether (or not) the enemy can see unconscious party members is random.