The Black Wyrm's Lair - Forums > EDE... I need help

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Nominar

Feb 5 2010, 11:31 PM

Yes, it's the famous Epic Divine Encounter that I'm stuck on. I want to finish the game before starting a new v6 game, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen in the next month or so with the tactics I'm currently using.

OK, so here's my party:

Vagrant protagonist - 32
Minsc (Berserker) - 36
F/M - 23/20
Anomen - 38
Imoen - 30
Nalia - 30

I've forged every IA item that I want, I've got JD and FoDaW on my Vagrant, both halberds and Staff of the Ram on Minsc, Hammer of Thor and Death of a Thousand Cuts on F/M. I've got Gaxx +5 but all other rings/cloaks are of +2 enchantment, in harmony with the next version. I'm not using rod of resurrection, also in harmony with v6.

I summon basically everything I can, 5 swanmays, 4 mordy swords, planetar, greater djinni and a noble spider. Most of the summons go straight for the prince to delay him while the greater swanmays and the queen help my warriors. I focus the Supreme Golem and have both bleeding weapons equipped in main hand. I usually get him down to badly injured before the first wave of the rakshasas spawn and then the bleeding effect may or may not take him down to near death while I focus the rakshasas. I normally kill the first wave of rakshasas before they can do any harm and then finish of the SG quiet easily. Then I focus the Ultra Golem (with crushing weapons equipped in main hand) and by the time the first UG is dead my summons are as well (if not earlier).
Next, I focus the Elemental Golem or the second UG, whichever is closer. I try to station my F/M so that the prince is more likely to attack her. I've never managed to get farther than this; the newly spawned rakshasas I can't kill fast enough either because my HLAs are exhausted or I can't reach them because of all the minor golems that block my every move. And then comes the dreaded "purge magic" something and my F/M is chunked (!) within seconds either by golems or >9000 ADHW. When the F/M is gone the prince is free to attack my vagrant or Minsc and my resistances are no more resistances. And then my party is history.

I've got 5 Barbarian Essence potions; Minsc drinks 3 of them while my vagrant only drinks 1 which is enough to get both up to 100% physical res. with Hardiness. The last one I'm saving for later use in the battle, in case the duration expires. I'm using the dual halberds tactic although I favor Poseidon's. Nalia's job is to summon more help, mainly MS, and Imoen's is to cast Wish and Remove Magic. Anomen is obviously a sitting duck, casting GR and occasionally refreshing Regeneration on Minsc, if he's able to get out of the wall-of-golems that is. I try to keep the warrior's HLAs up all the time.
My F/M has got 51 PFMW scrolls but I haven't been able to use but 1 of those (I normally use memorized spells because they are faster thanks to the Amulet of Power, even though I know scrolls can't be interrupted, with careful timing I've never been interrupted). I buff my F/M so that it takes 6 RRoR to take down her SI:Abj. Or one purge magic

I'm playing on core rules. Shouldn't this be an optional battle?

bulian

Feb 6 2010, 06:20 AM

A few comments - I wasn't able to finish EDE with a similar party on my first run. Its called "epic" for a reason. That being said, I think I could probably win it, now that I understand the mechanics of the fight. Keep trying!

EDE is really the last fight in the game - Mel is vanilla, so in some sense EDE is optional.

SPOILER!

Unfortunately, with that party, you only have 4 melee, so your damage output isn't as good as if Nalia were a fighter. You can probably get away with your sorceror for buffs, especially considering you will get plenty of wishes from the JD sword - staff of magi, or better, royal elemental staff + tensors, with Nalia may help out a bit. I've never used tensors, but I believe you can use triggers, contingencies, and scrolls while tensored. You won't need many PFMW scrolls while the prince still has his army - using offensive HLAs is much better, even better than summoning swanmays.

What is Anomen doing? Casting greater resto each round? Hopefully hes in the thick of things. Give him a shield when its time to cast greater resto. You also have your cat figurine once per wish rest.

You want bleeding weapons MH when fighting the golems to maximize damage. You should be using "critical strike" every round, and everyone should be improved hasted at all times. Burst damage isn't useful against the golems.

Don't be afraid to burn 9th level spells on Improved Alacrity - instantly reapplied improved hastes to everyone after "remove magic" help quite a bit. 8th level protective spells are superior to similar 6th level and 3rd level spells in terms of speed in reprotecting people.

Check the damage resistances of the major golems carefully - elemental golems should be a lower priority than UG, but some of your weapons aren't very effective against UG. Perhaps you can take them down simultaneously?

Skeletal warriors will last longer than mordy swords. Plus you can put skeletal warriors in spell triggers. I didn't find the noble spider to be very helpful, actually for 90% of the game.

See if you can figure out what causes the dreaded "purge magic" - my experience is that certain combinations of buffs on a single character tend to trigger it. Avoid those combinations until absolutely necessary.

Nominar

Feb 6 2010, 01:34 PM

Thanks for a good reply! I'll keep trying.

QUOTE

I'd never thought about using Nalia this way, but when you mention it, it kinda makes sense. She can easily protect herself from everything there and in this way she can reach the other party members to buff them with Prot. from Energy.

QUOTE

What is Anomen doing? Casting greater resto each round? Hopefully hes in the thick of things. Give him a shield when its time to cast greater resto. You also have your cat figurine once per wish rest.

Using Anomen as a warrior is probably the right thing to do, since I can get extra 8 attacks/round with him dual wielding. But it's going to be hard to protect him from physical attacks as I only have 5 BE potions. And I noticed the spell 'Holy Power' actually lowers his THAC0 all of a sudden, anyone know why that is?

QUOTE

Skeletal warriors will last longer than mordy swords. Plus you can put skeletal warriors in spell triggers. I didn't find the noble spider to be very helpful, actually for 90% of the game.

I actually used SW in some attempts but Mordy's Swords are harder to kill (I think) and the duration has never been a problem, all my summons are killed before they unsummon. The noble spider isn't very useful at this point, that is true.

QUOTE

See if you can figure out what causes the dreaded "purge magic" - my experience is that certain combinations of buffs on a single character tend to trigger it. Avoid those combinations until absolutely necessary.

I thought the 'purge magic' thingy was on a timer? And certain combinations of buffs cause it? I can only imagine that must be the F/M.

If everything else fails, I might lower the difficulty level. I'm not very keen on doing that though.

bulian

Feb 6 2010, 09:32 PM

Re skeleton warriors, from Sikret's walkthrough near Underdark section

SPOILER!

QUOTE

Greater Restoration is cast. E. Golem shifted target to hit mordy sword. Elemental golems (and golems greater than the Elemental ones) are professional killers of mordy swords and other summoned creatures.

I don't know exactly what he means, but I think the golems may cast a "death" like spell on mordy swords, so I think (and have seen) that it only takes one attack and they're dead. Feel free to test and confirm - you can probably get an estimate of mordy sword hp by killing one yourself, and then starting an encounter with all mordy swords as your summons. Repeat with SW and see whether it makes a difference. I don't track summon hp specifically, but based on the lifetime of the summons, skeleton warriors seem to soak up their hp worth of damage before dying.

Just for fun, take your characters and run around, and watch the speed of the summons when you're not actually fighting combat - half a round or a quarter round from using the right summons can make a big difference.

Perhaps the "holy power" modifies his thaco from the base cleric table and not the IA one? I don't use that spell. Not sure...

Even 4 attacks per round with Anomen if you give him a shield are better than none.

I don't know specifically the conditions for "purge magic", my observations are empirical. Once you can get the army down and start fighting the prince, it may be a bit easier to figure out what buff combinations could trigger the spell.

Also, can someone put my previous post in spoiler tags? I didn't mean to leave it for all the world to see if they didn't want to, and don't know how (or am unable) to edit my posts.

critto

Feb 7 2010, 09:16 AM

SPOILER!

Golems don't have any magic which kill your summons in one hit. They deal physical and, some of them, elemental damage, but that is all. No Death spells.

Sikret

Feb 7 2010, 10:52 AM

@Critto
SPOILER!

It depends on the golem type. The bigger golems have some tricks in their sleeves against summoned creatures (hence, my reference to the 'professional killers of summoned creatures')

Kerkes

Feb 11 2010, 01:03 PM

just some toughts...
SPOILER!

I think "holy power" might not go well wit STR boosting Items but not sure.
Also, in EDE, you have to kill (from my experience anyway) one enemy very, very fast.
Keep the main oponnent busy with a mage (Nalia, for example). Fighters do not fare well if left alone with him.
3 fighters are more then enough for this battle, you don't need Anomen in combat, and shield and AC will do very little here, when
he gets pounded by 10+ golems anyway. Use HLAs. Critical strikes are your best friend here.
"purge magic" is on both timer and depends on your buffs, I believe. It can be used to your advantage, however. just make sure your mages are under Alcatry when it happens

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