Bill Bisco - My Testing, Testing for experienced players Options

[Senka]

OMG...
Dude you just broke quest of one of your NPC. At least...
Tutorial - for pure game only. Got it?

[Bill Bisco]

Yea, something's wrong with the Tutorial. Anyway, I decided to start a new multiplayer game.

It seems very hard to fail Pick pockets when you're trying to. Perhaps I should get my character really drunk



Now that I completed the quest, the boy is here.



It'd be nice if we could steal that Knucklehead Trout back



I just spent a fortune getting my high Con character drunk. Can I get some rumors Quimby please???



Even drunk I can't fail at pickpocketing!



This is a very deceptive screen here. It's not entirely clear that saying I don't have room for Hrothgar (which I didn't last time) is killer to the mod.





I finally get to continue!





This post has been edited by Bill Bisco: May 27 2015, 05:10 PM

[Vlad]

You should restart. As I explained, leaving Hrothgar behind stops NeJ's plot.

[Bill Bisco]

Dar is listed as Exportable. As an NPC this should not happen.



Yay, a club finally! Thank you!



I think whenever I get kicked out of a store screen, that means I failed to steal? Nothing keeps me from going back and trying again. Look at all these nice +2 Slings that I stole!



I casted Remove Curse, Neutralize Poison, Cure Serious Wounds, and Cure Disease. Shouldn't at least one of these spells help this poor goblin?

[Vlad]

Shouldn't at least one of these spells help this poor goblin?

If you know the plot, it won't help.

This post has been edited by Vlad: May 27 2015, 06:11 PM

[Bill Bisco]

A nice goblin cave with weak goblins in it. No goblin king. No treasure chest. What the heck was that Rakasha doing earlier with the goblins? I can't seem to find any secret doors either.



Hrothgar still thinks he's the pizazz.



If I say no to Hrothgar, he tells Accalia to leave with him. And then I'm in a cutscene and can't leave. It's be really nice to get a GAME OVER screen here:\



This dialogue is much nicer. It let's me roleplay as a badguy, but nonetheless let me know I must be committed to this plot!



If you choose the option "Tell me again what must be done, eventually the dialogue breaks. This happens with or without Hrothgar in your party





So it appears I accidently (and finally failed my pickpocket. I killed Urnst by accident (auto attack scripts). And now I went to another house. Well, this citizen instantly knew that I failed to pickpocket Urnst and he too unfortunately died due to auto attack scripts.

[Bill Bisco]

I really hate these things:



Some of the townsfolk run away from the Yeti (these ones will).



This lady doesn't seem to care



You'd think Dar would have something to say about about being in a Temple of Ilmater, but he is very silent.



This post has been edited by Bill Bisco: May 27 2015, 07:42 PM

[Vlad]

I hope you continue.

[Bill Bisco]

Equipping this item deals 6 hp damage for some reason



See Imoen died (but she still thinks she's hold this staff)




Where is the Stealing Button! I want to be rewarded for putting points into PickPocket!



This is my favorite way of playing: disposable minions in front, party members armed with ranged weapons behind them. This method avoid a lot of annoying enemies. Those goblins with poisoned arrows and those Draining Shadows and Poison Mists in this Vale of Shadows that we're in. It requires me to rest less and not to have to micromanage spells all the time, but we can still use them if we face a tough enemy that requires more thinking.

This another reason why I love Clerics: Animate Dead. I don't have to go searching for monster summoning spells and Animate Dead comes quicker for Clerics and automatically. Having myself (Cleric/Thief), Dar (Fighter/Cleric), and Accalia (Cleric) all being able to cast this spell is mighty fine and nice, letting use get enough uses of this spell in order to clear out a map.

By the way, I've learned from the goblin areas, that you mean business when we rest in enemy territory. I nearly lost the game to that from those goblins. I walk all the way back to town before I dare rest now.

Of course, this only highlights the fact that there's some more spells that should be modded in: Rope Trick or Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion – Hassle Free Resting Everywhere.



I really wish there was a script for how I play. I put my disposable minions always in front. I have to constantly pause and click to ensure that my skeletons stay in front.



These skeletons will attack Tundra Yetis in the Darkness, but Tundra Yetis will target skeletons from the darkness only after they've been hit. Essentially I get a free attack off. This isn't all the time but some of the time



Are there infinite Vampire Mists here? Always sneaking behind me and trying to attack? I guess not, good job on making me feel that way though.

[Bill Bisco]

Thanks for the Sling of Seeking. I really wish BG2 didn't remove Strength bonuses from ranged weapons. This item gives it back like it should. Unfortunately the only NPC starting with Sling Proficiency is Accalia but she only has 13 Strength and cannot benefit from this.

It would be nice if both Dar and Shar Teel had points in ranged weapons. It is sorely needed. The Sling of Seeking will have to be used by the main character (me, for now).



I just drunk potions of master thievery and now my pick pocket is 245! I still see no button to steal! Please let me steal from stores in this town! The inn guy and the wizard in the tower guy! No steal button! Me sad!




I didn't realize that the Yeti Pelt Bag was more than just a bag for holding Yeti Pelts. You actually gave us a bag of holding. Thanks.

[Bill Bisco]

This battle feels too much. I'm having to cheese this battle to win it. Constantly moving in and out. The monsters can't follow me because it's a “You must gather your party to venture forth” area change



Just How many Yeti Live on this Mountain? 2K XP per yeti. 3 yetis at a time. 1K xp per party member per rest. The yetis are melee and don't have too many hit points. This is a decent XP Farming location.



Yes, I'm sorry; I have to cheese this battle by shooting, retreating, heailng, re-entering, shooting some more. Going back to town resting, going back to this place and reshooting. Even with the best armor available Shar-Teel and Accalia get damaged this much within a few seconds and I've already cleared a lot of these undead. Such is the way of things.



This dialogue refers to a Sword. Except Imoen does not have a sword and cannot use one as she is Still Dual Classing to Mage.



Hrothga randomly dies in this tomb for seemingly no reason. If you'd check into this it'd be appreciated. Edit: Nvm. Random Trap. Find Traps Failed me!



This post has been edited by Bill Bisco: May 30 2015, 04:03 AM

[Bill Bisco]

Oh my dear goodness. Vlad! I love Myrkul! One of my old characters was a Priest of Myrkul! Please let me worship Myrkul!



I don't want to kill him! You're going to make me kill him aren't you? *Weepingly Sobs*



Gosh dang it. Only 1 option. The designers hate undead. Le Sigh.



I am Sad.



Timestop at this level? Really?



Are we supposed to get through this door? My people can't get through. Edit: Figured it out.



This post has been edited by Bill Bisco: May 30 2015, 06:23 AM

[Senka]

My people can't get through. Edit: Figured it out.

Use another party formation. Line for example. Your leader would be first

[Bill Bisco]

Now I've got to find this Priestess of Auril. I was sure I explored every tomb in the Vale of Shadows already.

[Senka]

Did you speak with maiden Lisan in Kuldahar tavern?

[Vlad]

Bill, I have done some changes partially according to your advices, partially as I see them myself.

1) You don't have any more option to steal from stores.
2) Townies will give you different warnings, one or two, randomly in both towns if you try to steal from them and fail.
3) Hrothgar will warn you if you don't join him that you cannot leave the town without him, and tell you that you can come back when you change your mind.
4) I've removed the buggy BG2 rod from the store and placed another tome instead.
5) Yeti are now more powerful, so you cannot easily make an XP farm of them (However, if you remember the sirens shore in BG, that was also the XP farm).
6) Two broken links in dialogues, which you have spotted, are fixed.
7) Rumours are now easy to get in the taverns.

The rest is game related, and I prefer to keep it as it is.

[EDIT] Please don't do tricks like joining and throwing NPCs from the group in the same dialogue window. These tricks are potentially game- or quest-breaking in the core game. The Infinity engine is not perfect and cannot account for all those tricks. Normally, what happens in such cases, is changing the dialogue to leaving dialogue of the NPC, and you won't be able to bring the previous dialogue options back until you properly join him/her. I can edit HROTHP dialogue to account for this particular trick, but I cannot account for all possible tricks you can do. So, just bear this in mind.

This post has been edited by Vlad: May 30 2015, 02:40 PM

[Bill Bisco]

Thanks Vlad. Just a note that I don't really advocate removing stealing from stores. Pickpocket is on of the few things that make thieves and bards unique. (Hide in shadows is trumped by invisibility, open locks is trumped by Knock, find remove traps is somewhat trumped by find traps spell, detect illusions is trumped by true sight spell, and so forth. If you make stealing from stores impossible here, then it's just that more worthless to play a thief ( and in of itself encourages more grinding for gold)

[Senka]

Frankly you have enough NPC-thieves.

[Vlad]

Bill, you'll have so much gold there that you can just buy what you need. I don't like the option of robbing stores because those items will make the whole game very easy. What's the sense of getting through the hordes of undead and other creatures, thinking about tactics and so on if you can get any item from the beginning and ease your game until the point the game lacks any challenge.

[Bill Bisco]

Thanks for the tip Senka.

Vlad, I would note that even after plundering the Vale of Shadows, Overall I still don't have *That* much money. Combined from the Orc caves, I had about 20K Gold total since the beginning of NeJ and now after spending I have around 16K.



Look at some of these prices and imagine trying to support 2 mages to get equipment and spells?




Look at these prices and think of party members we have to support. And, there's more than this.




In short, there's no way we have enough money via dedicated questing to get all the items the party needs to be top notch. And remember too that the best items in the game are not bought but rather they are found and/or crafted.

So no frankly based on my testing, this mod does not give us all the gold that we need. Denying stealing from stores just makes us more likely to choose to grind for gold (the best location for Gold Grinding seems to be the Orc Caves at the moment, you kill orcs until they drop scrolls and sell off the scrolls.) And this only serves to reinforce the notion that Thieves Suck. At least thieves gave us an opportunity to avoid some grind.

As far as challenge goes, one can always play a solo game, put the difficulty on insane, self-deny certain tactics (force-talking), and/or Install Sword Coast Stratagems.

This post has been edited by Bill Bisco: May 30 2015, 09:14 PM