Contest: "Guess the scene!", Discussion topic -- post here please! Options

[Baronius]

I must note that Nimbul spawns in front of the Inn, rather than on the bridge, so that is another flaw in the picture.

Spawns, but he doesn't have to stay there. The pictures aren't exact replicas of the game scenes, so it's not really a flaw in this respect.

However, the problem with Bardolan is that he is an Amnish soldier (with the typical helmet, armour and weapons), so he doesn't nearly resemble to the guy on the picture. In your place, this would have been enough for me to prefer Nimbul to Bardolan.

Let's not forget though that this was just the first week, and many more will come, so those who didn't get too high score will also have plenty of possibilities

[Moongaze]

Your answer to Q2 mentioned "reading the documents", which is apparently a minor detail, however, Chapter 3 is triggered by opening the chest (and taking those documents). So this was a "modder" answer, hence the bonus point.

Ah, right. Lucky strike.

I must note that Nimbul spawns in front of the Inn, rather than on the bridge, so that is another flaw in the picture.

Spawns, but he doesn't have to stay here. The pictures aren't exact replicas of the game scenes, so it's not really a flaw in this respect.

Yeh, to me he looked like Nimbul, so I answered that. I figured he could walk to the bridge if he wanted to.

[HERD]

A-a-a-a-a! I thought I would get a +0.000005 for speeed!
Gimmi, Gimmi !!!

This post has been edited by HERD: Jul 8 2008, 12:07 PM

[Baronius]

Your replacement submission (where you mentioned Nimbul correctly) arrived after Moongaze, but since this was the first week, we can make an exception: choose, do you want to lose 1 point (= Nimbul) and get +0.000005, or is the current setup acceptable?

Actually, it isn't a bad idea to give +0.5 point to the person who first submits answers. This would mean a little advantage for those with good memory of the game's events and details, because everyone can visit the area in the game (provided he/she recognized it) or "scan" the game with Near Infinity or some other tool, but the search takes time, while writing from memory is quick. Of course, this might result in many submitted entries at the very beginning (everyone would want the bonus score), due to the fact that sending a replacement submission is allowed for one day. So after sending the "quick-submission", participants would more thoroughly check whether the answers they've sent are correct, and if it's worth it, they send the corrections as a replacement submission. I don't see anything wrong with this: the one day limit of sending the replacement submission is present, so it wouldn't ruin the contest in my opinion. (A replacement submission would negate the possible bonus +0.5 point of the first submission, of course.)

What do you think, Sir Carnifex?

[dzidek1983]

then you should add the exact time of the next picture, not only a day...

[Sir_Carnifex]

Yeh, to me he looked like Nimbul, so I answered that. happy I figured he could walk to the bridge if he wanted to.

As I told Baronius, the first time I met Nimbul, he met me almost at the top of the bridge. I think I just stopped when I saw him and let him walk up to me. So, yes, he can move.

Your replacement submission (where you mentioned Nimbul correctly) arrived after Moongaze, but since this was the first week, we can make an exception: choose, do you want to lose 1 point (= Nimbul) and get +0.000005, or is the current setup acceptable? tongue.gif

Actually, it isn't a bad idea to give +0.5 point to the person who first submits answers. This would mean a little advantage for those with good memory of the game's events and details, because everyone can visit the area in the game (provided he/she recognized it) or "scan" the game with Near Infinity or some other tool, but the search takes time, while writing from memory is quick. Of course, this might result in many submitted entries at the very beginning (everyone would want the bonus score), due to the fact that sending a replacement submission is allowed for one day. So after sending the "quick-submission", participants would more thoroughly check whether the answers they've sent are correct, and if it's worth it, they send the corrections as a replacement submission. I don't see anything wrong with this: the one day limit of sending the replacement submission is present, so it wouldn't ruin the contest in my opinion. (A replacement submission would negate the possible bonus +0.5 point of the first submission, of course.)

I'm not in favor of it since:

1. It could possibly put someone's score above six.

2. Those who are in or around my time zone are much more likely to get first shot at it.

3. You nixed my idea of bonus points the one time I mentioned it...

[Baronius]

Those who are in or around my time zone are much more likely to get first shot at it.

Not if you get up at night to post the picture, so European participants can find it because it's morning here. (Actually, participants in your timezone would also be sleeping, so it would make the contest unfair after all )

We could set the 6 points as an upper limit that can't be exceeded, but let's drop the whole idea.

By the way: new picture should arrive soon! More precisely, as soon as Sir Carnifex is online again So stay tuned and keep checking the Pictures topic!

[The Bigg]

You could set up a PM bot to avoid the hassle (or an ad-hoc simplicistic PHP page): you contact the bot once for the picture, and then you contact the bot again with the answer, and the person with the smallest delta wins the point. Of course, JC refused this very idea for IM, on the basis that, uh, allowing people from Asia to take part in is less important than the feeling that 1/1,000,000,000 of the global Earth population is competing with you RIGHT NOW.

This post has been edited by The Bigg: Jul 9 2008, 12:08 PM

[Sir_Carnifex]

You could set up a PM bot to avoid the hassle (or an ad-hoc simplicistic PHP page): you contact the bot once for the picture, and then you contact the bot again with the answer, and the person with the smallest delta wins the point. Of course, JC refused this very idea for IM, on the basis that, uh, allowing people from Asia to take part in is less important than the feeling that 1/1,000,000,000 of the global Earth population is competing with you RIGHT NOW.

Eh... Sounds kind of complicated for a simple contest!

And back to topic, the new Guess the Scene drawing is now in, so feel free to start discussing it.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Answers send.
Edit; Baronius, thanks for the confirmation reply.

This post has been edited by Jarno Mikkola: Jul 9 2008, 09:36 PM

[Moongaze]

Well, I guess I'm out.
At present, I have no idea.

[lroumen]

I thought they were close replicas, since you need to spot what's wrong with the picture. If too much artistic freedom is added, it may result in several possibilities that were not necessarily the intended. I was totally off on my guesses though .

I'm not certain whether I got this week's picture correct, but there's a lot more info added to my submission than the first time.

[Moongaze]

After a good long thought, I think I have figured it out after all.
Submission sent!

[dzidek1983]

Submission sent... it was easy but i made a mistake (didn't read closely) and had to make a correction to one of the questions, remeber to answer after you had your morning coffe

hope i won't get any minus points for that

[Baronius]

I thought they were close replicas, since you need to spot what's wrong with the picture. If too much artistic freedom is added, it may result in several possibilities that were not necessarily the intended.

I agree. Sir Carnifex is trying to do his best for the drawing and questions. The contest is new, so we also learn several things while organizing it. When allocating points, we also consider the relative correctness of answers (so those who gave better answers get more points, other gets less -- but not necessarily zero -- points). Of course, one could say that it's unfair, because those who are lucky (made the good guess from the possible choices) will get the most points. Since the contest is about "guessing", it also has to do with luck anyway.

Fortunately, if practically no one answers a question, no one will get the points so it won't make any difference in the results. Furthermore, no minus points are given for anything. For questions that don't require a unique answer, you can list more things. For example, this is the case with the "what's wrong" question, but e.g. not with the question of "who is it" (where a multiple answer such as "It is either Nimbul or Bardolan" means 0 score) and the question "does the viewer intend to complete the quest?" also doesn't allow multiple answers (that is, answers in the form "IF-THEN, IF-THEN" are not good, conditional statements aren't encouraged).

hope i won't get any minus points for that

Didn't you read the rules? A replacement reply reduces your maximum score to 50%. Actually, no, it doesn't I was kidding. The rules clearly say the each participant is allowed to send a replacement submission in 24 hours from the time the first submission was sent.

Edit; Baronius, thanks for the confirmation reply

You're welcome. I'll send a confirmation to everyone who submits an entry; if I don't do so in a reasonable time, contact me. I advise everyone to tick the checkbox "Add a copy of this message to my sent items" folder, and if unsure whether it has been correctly sent, just check the Sent Items folder.

[Moongaze]

and the question "does the viewer intend to complete the quest?" also doesn't allow multiple answers (that is, answers in the form "IF-THEN, IF-THEN" are not good, conditional statements aren't encouraged).

I found that a very tricky question to answer. It asks about the intention of a player, which is different for everyone. Some will complete the quest in a certain way, others in other ways (perhaps even ignoring it altogether). Or was this not what Sir Carnifex meant? I sure read it as such.

This post has been edited by Moongaze: Jul 10 2008, 02:17 PM

[Baronius]

This is the question (so we can see what we're speaking about):

The owner of the building provides a quest. Does the viewer (protagonist) intend to complete it? (3 points)

As you've written, the protagonist's decisions can be different for everyone during each game, but the contest would make little sense if it asked for detailed quest descriptions, or would allow more correct but completely different answers. So the only possible conclusion is that the picture reveals it. (In other words, Sir Carnifex, when saying "viewer", refers to the protagonist who actually experiences the scene on the picture. I admit "viewer" might refer to everyone who views the picture, but this interpretation has two problems. First of all, as written above, the contest would make little sense in that case. The second counter-argument is that Sir Carnifex has written "protagonist" in brackets. I believe that we -- picture viewers -- aren't protagonists, just players who control the protagonist. )

Generally, if you believe that a question is ambigious, i.e. its meaning is not clear or it seems to have more correct answers, try to focus on the picture. The picture is meant to clear up any ambiguity. It's also needless to say that each (directly visible or indirectly deducible) detail might be important.

[Moongaze]

Eh, how confusing... hang on...

[Baronius]

It's also important to note that when you see some odd or apparently incorrect element on the picture, there are two possibilities:

• Your guess is entirely wrong, and the picture element is OK.
• Your guess is OK, and the picture element is wrong (and as such, perhaps an answer to the "what is wrong" question)

One could say that this is unfair, because there is no way to decide which of the two is the case. Let's use our common sense. When you find suspiciously too many flaws in the picture, it has a good chance that your guess is wrong. This is why it's so important to examine each element and detail on the picture, and possibly deduce some indirect information from it as well. The picture tries to present typical features of the scene, and it's unlikely that more typical features are incorrect.

Regarding the possibility of multiple or conditional answers, I would like to emphasize another thing (at the risk of stating the obvious). When there is a yes/no question (e.g. anything that starts with "Does", "Do", "Will" etc. and ends in a question mark), we always expect a yes/no answer (with an explanation). Any such answer is worth more points than a multiple or conditional answer.

[Sir_Carnifex]

Regarding question #4.

I put protagonist in there because, in this particular picture, the view is supposed to be that of the protagonist. Answers for #4 are supposed to be based on what you can see in the picture. Some of you have been answering it like a trivia that does not require a picture. Since the questions seems to have been misunderstood by some, those who did misunderstand them should be able to correct answers to just #4 based on the clarification I posted here. Best wait for confirmation by Baronius on this one since I won't be around for the end result.

It's still a tricky question, though.