Must forge items Options

[Mongerman]

Thought I'd start a thread discussing must forge items introduced by IA, so new players can decide where to spend their precious gold on.

Must forge items

1. Boots of impr haste - With belm in off hand, and gauntlets of extraordinary spec, its like having permanent GWW activated! Whats not to like? With these boots, you are free to take multiple critical strikes.

2. Memory of the Apprenti - 3 extra spells per level. With specialist class, thats 4 extra spells per level. You could stand forever in the midst of the most powerfull melee monsters and emerge without a stratch.

3. Holy avenger - When multiple RoR still dont work, never fret, holy avenger is here! Combine with time trap and a WW for extra effectiveness.

4. Improved Cat Figurine - Greater restoration on steriods, without exhausting the user. Enough said.

I havent gotten around to forging more weapons yet,so no opinions there for now.

[Sikret]

News about items in IA v4.3:

(I) Usabilities:

1- Boots of Improved Haste will be usable only by rangers (rangers are scouts); however, if you upgrade the boots one step further to "Boots of Agility" (see the items file) then it will become usable by all (except monks) again.

2- Flail of Defending and Wounding will be usable only by single class rangers (unlike the boots of Improved Haste, the flail won't be usable by Ranger/Clerics --I have my own justification for this difference).

3- Holy Avenger will not be usable even by thieves who have "Use Any Item" ability.

4- "Judgement Day" and "The Truth" swords will not be usable by Fighter/mages (and other multiclass fighters) any more. Only single class (good) warriors can use them. thetruth had asked this from me even before the release of v4.2 but I had forgot to implement it. Now it is done for v4.3

(II) New item upgrades:

1- Keldorn's armor can be improved.

2- A new item upgrade is added which is specific to Vagrants. (A new armor is added to the game which is only usable by vagrant and stalker. It can be upgraded but only a vagrant protagonist can upgrade it.

[rbeverjr]

News about items in IA v4.3:

(I) Usabilities:

1- Boots of Improved Haste will be usable only by rangers (rangers are scouts); however, if you upgrade the boots one step further to "Boots of Agility" (see the items file) then it will become usable by all (except monks) again.

2- Flail of Defending and Wounding will be usable only by single class rangers (unlike the boots of Improved Haste, the flail won't be usable by Ranger/Clerics --I have my own justification for this difference).

3- Holy Avenger will not be usable even by thieves who have "Use Any Item" ability.

4- "Judgement Day" and "The Truth" swords will not be usable by Fighter/mages (and other multiclass fighters) any more. Only single class (good) warriors can use them. thetruth had asked this from me even before the release of v4.2 but I had forgot to implement it. Now it is done for v4.3

(II) New item upgrades:

1- Keldorn's armor can be improved.

2- A new item upgrade is added which is specific to Vagrants. (A new armor is added to the game which is only usable by vagrant and stalker. It can be upgraded but only a vagrant protagonist can upgrade it.

Personally, I have always thought that the UAI HLA was a bit much any way. Then I met, IA and decided differently. I am disappointed by the first 2 changes because I feel like any class could benefit from the boots of IH (75,000 cheaper than the other boots) and that any class that could use a flail could benefit from the FoDW. I don't particularly like rangers. This rule change will force me to dump the use of FoDW before I really wanted to, or stick to v. 4.2 for a while.

[Sikret]

or stick to v. 4.2 for a while.

This is a very bad idea. Many more bugs of the original game are fixed in v4.3 (such as the bug with spell shield). Always play IA with its latest version; otherwise, you may face bugs which wouldn't exist in your game if you had upgraded the mod to its latest version. (To be able to use a flail and a pair of boots by a non-ranger character is not so much of a bonus for which you want to stick to v4.2 and miss all of the other new and important changes.)

[Romulas]

or stick to v. 4.2 for a while.

This is a very bad idea. Many more bugs of the original game are fixed in v4.3 (such as the bug with spell shield). Always play IA with its latest version; otherwise, you may face bugs which wouldn't exist in your game if you had upgraded the mod to its latest version. (To be able to use a flail and a pair of boots by a non-ranger character is not so much of a bonus for which you want to stick to v4.2 and miss all of the other new and important changes.)

Is it so bad to play a game the way you want to? It is after all my (and our) time that we are spending on it. Is the goal here to put out something that people can play or drive them away from it? It seems like a general goal of IA is to slash some classes and elevate others. To elevate others is a fine idea and one that I agree with, just not at the expense of the other classes, not in the way you are suggesting.

More pointedly, for your changes:

1) Judgement Day sword: I agree, its benefits best suit a fighter type class, the F/M can get those abilities anyway.

2) thetruth longsword: Questionable, I don't see it tipping the scales of power that much, it is good against the outer planar beings, a decent sword otherwise.

3) holy avenger: nuff said

4) flail and boots: My above statement holds for these two. A clear example of limiting all other classes.

For we that are not super at this game those boots actually give us a chance to beat some of the more difficult encounters before spellhold, for instance for the tough battles where the enemy has resistances to most weapon types, (golems, torgal, ect.) one logical way of countering this is to have more attacks, in this way we can at least have a chance.

As someone said earlier, to try and get players to play different classes, elevate those classes by expanding their stronghold, or as I suggest implementing new items for them only, not limiting already established items.

Romulas

[thetruth]

2) thetruth longsword: Questionable, I don't see it tipping the scales of power that much, it is good against the outer planar beings, a decent sword otherwise.

Hey it's not Sikret's fault for that!
I had asked him to make it usable only by single-classed, good-aligned "warriors".

It's just how I see the sword,though I can't justify it's usage only by pure warriors ( ) But anyway, as you said, it's not even so powerful compared to other weapons (even some of the original game).

I agree with your other points though.

The Holy Avenger should be usable only by Paladins.
As for the Boots, for me they shouldn't be in the game at all, but that's an other issue.

This post has been edited by thetruth: Jun 3 2007, 07:25 PM

[Sikret]

As for the Boots, for me they shouldn't be in the game at all, but that's an other issue.

Limiting the usability of powerful item is a step towards what you have in mind. I will also make the boots and the flail more difficult to forge for the next version (i.e. I will change their forging recipes). I am also thinking of nerfing the flail a little bit.

As for forcing players to play with rangers, I really fail to see how these changes can be interpreted in this way. You can always give those boots (or the flail) to Valygar or Minsk without being forced to pick a ranger protagonist. Adding the new kit to the game was to add new flavor to the game and to *encourage* (not to force) players to think about playing a ranger as an interesting class, however.

As for the other changes, I think that they can (at least to some extent) fill the gap of power between F/Ms and other classes.

Note that thetruth has completed the game without using any of the mod's items, which means that you can enjoy playing the mod without concentrating on the items and without depending on them. All of the battles are doable without those items.

All this said, all of these changes are reversible. If in the future I see that limiting the usability of those items were not a good idea, I can change them back again. The whole issue is not really very important. Let's try enjoying the content of the mod, instead . Some new contents are also added to IA v4.3. They are in testing stage.