Profanity in mods, [split by Baronius; Domi's request] Options

[Domi]

BG1 is a PG13 game, so the developper to start with did not intend it for children. There are characters in BG1 that say stuff like "Will one of you rugged adventurers give me a good, hard shag?"

The mods/mods components are sometimes rated as well (for example some of BG1NPC Romances are rated R for language or adult situations), while the mod itself is the same as the game, to avoid embaracing the selective players. It will be nice, if people used the rating system more vigorously.

I guess this is why most sci-fi/fantasy tv creates new profanities - frac, frell etc

And that is why the authors who have guts to carter to adult audience and have no pangs of guilt about it, read so real and have their own appreciative following. (Points to Martin).

In other words, do what you feel is right, just warn the consummer about it. I always make a point of explaining that Martin is gritty, uses the obscenities and does not draw curtains when his characters decided to make love, when I recommend his books. Yes, I love what he does. No, I don't expect everyone to agree with me that it is how it should be done.

This post has been edited by Domi: Jan 9 2006, 09:03 PM

[Sorrow]

And pretty much the only way of adding these options to the game is via dialog. I think most players know that if they launch a fireball at a group of commoners in the game it is going to result in death and that would be murder. Rape in the game would be a whole different affair which is why I think it is a bad idea to add it as any kind of random act you can choose to perpetrate. You can't launch a rape at someone and see the effects.

In BG words are pretty much all you have to describe any action other than what is covered by creature animations.

I think that there are two reasons to introduce rape:
1. Rape is one of main crimes and along with murder and thievery forms triad of human instincts:
Murder - desire to remove existence of other being
Thievery - desire to posess an item
Rape - desire to posess a person

2. <CHARNAME> isn't a normal person, it's a traumatised young man/woman that lives in constant danger and has tainted soul and has power, so I think that he/she is more prone to become a criminal than a common hero/citizen.

So I think that taking in account that PC has a big potential to become a twisted person, I think that providing an option of commiting main violent crimes is a sound idea.

I think the point trying to be made here is that rape is considered more degrading an act than murder. Murder does have a finality that rape does not have, one can murder for various reasons but the result is the same, the death of the victim. Rape on the other hand has lasting and various ill effects on the victim. A rapist goes in to a rape attack with the foreknowledge of this and that is what makes it low, they know that the act they are commiting will effect the victim for a long time to come.

I strongly disagree here.
The problem is that survivor of rape stays alive, can seek help, vengeance or something, while victim of murder can't do nothing and will never be able to do anything and to say anything.
It's easy to say that rape is worser than death, but I doubt you would say that at gunpoint.
IMO staying alive and with all senses/limbs/organs relatively intact is a priority.
Otherwise pointing gun at someone and telling that person to take off the clotches etc. would be very uneffective.

The second thing is that I disagree that attack on someones psyche is lower than physical attack.
Actually, psychical and emotional torture is more subtle, and thus higher than physical attack.
Therefore saying that rape is low because it touches higher emotions of victim than for example beating is contradictionary.

The statement wasn't about villains but about the acts commited. You could have the coolest looking rapist on the planet or the most vicious looking murderer, it makes no difference how cool they are. It is the act they are commiting that is being judged. In relation to the game, it would be very hard to make a rapist "look" cool but I do admit that it might be possible to do that with a murderer, sad though that is.

The main line of defence of cool (charismatic) criminals is their coolness and uncoolness of the victim, no matter if they are thieves, rapists or murderers.
Perpetuator of crime tries to make himself look cool and degrade the victim so that it would look like crime was a fault of victim.
Thief will say that he was stealing only from the rich and greedy, while rapist will try to imply that the victim was slut, liked it, wanted it, asked for it etc.
It's entirely possible to make rape look cool, by speaking of victim in derogatory terms.
Perpetuator of crime is higher life form, while the victim is a lower life form (subhuman, ifidel, capitalist, slut, arrogant whore, etc.)
I think that a character with high charisma can get away with rape in game just like in RL.

The Hitler statement didn't really make sense, you imply Hitler was cheap and dirty as a grand villain and yet state that he was the "coolest". You think cheap and dirty is cool?

Hitler based his popularity and success on being cool and telling german people that they are cool and that other people suck.
He told them that being strong is cool and that compassion sucks.
He told them to kill people that suck.
So, there was cool Hitler who had cool army and he created cheap and dirty holocaust.
I've read a novel that was written by the survivor of Aushvitz and he wrote that german SS officers were very narcistic, which included looking cool, and being so absorbed with their coolness that they ignored suffering of victims.
I have an impression that they felt like gods among slaves.
So I'm trying to say that coolness and grandness of villains is an illusion and gloryfying that illusion by placing such villains above common criminals is wrong.
We have two things - high things - Hitler and SS officers who were cool, grand and narcistic and low things - things that happened in concentration camp.
So, Hitler was cheap and dirty and cool at the same time.
So, taking in account that grand villains are cool and do cheap and dirty things at the same time, saying that evil isn't neccesary cheap and dirty is a lie.
Evil is cheap and dirty by definition and coolness and grandour of perpetuator doesn't make it less cheap and dirty.

This post has been edited by Sorrow: Jan 14 2006, 05:16 PM