IAv6 party composition, This was bound to come up Options

[lroumen]

Royal staff would work well if you plan on using staves rather than halberds.

I think level squatting is quite an okay tactics here if you dual at level 9. You just level up as a mage to level 5 (20k XP) and then wait with leveling up until you have 250k XP. That is only 230k XP of waiting which would be quite alright. You don't even need to delay quest rewards. I think you can wait that long and cast a few important spells from scrolls just fine and you'll have access to a few handy low level spells.

I'm thinking on whether it's better to go with staves or halberds. I'm thinking that staves get you less problems with weapon-resistances in the end. Most of the golems and skeletons seem to be more susceptible to crushing.


About the barbarian.
I thought that expanded dualclass options was something also in EOU, but it's bg2tweaks which we won't have installed. I'm thinking too far ahead again.


I've reduxed my thoughts on my party but I am still undecided.

1. Goodaligned Necromancer Protagonist (dart staff), spells
2. Valygar (flail, katana), protection and healing
3. Nalia or Jan (dagger, bow or crossbow), thieving, secondary arcane
4. Monk or Barbarian? Maybe again a riskbreaker?
5. Jaheira (club, scimitar, longsword, dualwield), buffing, melee -> Cernd (druid staves), summoning, buffing
6. Berserker -> Mage dualclass at level 9 (halberds, staves)

[Clown]

Your party looks quite powerful but I would still very strongly advise a sorcerer instead of Jan or Nalia though if your convinced you need one Nalia is probably a better choice as mage levels are always infinetly better than thief levels.

For four you know I'm going to say Riskbreaker but bezerker is also good, take some one who can get GM as you want to try and maximize melee attacks as your going to have maybe 3 or 4 characters with no meaningful melee output depending on your other choices.

For five auramasters look formidable in V5 but with your limited melee power I would probably go for Jaheira or better a r/c dual.

As for six I really don't advise this route, its entirely you choice but I would far prefer a F/M or a late dual especially in a party which has already got two full time arcane casters including the Necro who will be amazing.

I'm not saying any of your choices are bad and I hope I don't come across as overly critical, these are just my opinions fromm playing V6.

[Vuki]

I like very much monks in the standard game however in IA they are not so powerfull anymore. Their battle abilities (stun, ...) are very usefull but on high level they are simple not useable. Maybe a retuning for V7?

[lroumen]

I think your advice is quite helpful.

I just prefer to take along a thief of any kind to do trap detection and picking locks. That is why I do not go for the sorceress. I think that in that regard, Nalia will probably suffice although Jan can be expanded further later on with detect illusions.

Your point on grandmastery is logical and I overlooked that part. I will probably take the berserker then because I like some confusion/charm immunity albeit only temporarily.
My problem in IA is often that I only manage to reprotect 4 out of 6 party members when the party gets dispelled. I'd like some more sturdy behaviour in that regard... an easier time, so it would be good to go with a few more characters that can negate these things.


As for 6, I won't do the level squatting, I just wanted to point out that it is very well doable.

Anyway, a F->M seems like a good choice to me. If you immediately take the grandmastery from the start then you don't need more than 9 levels of fighter and thus you regain your abilities much sooner than when you wait until level 13. That means you do not miss a lot of melee power either. You do miss 1 prof and some thac0, but you regain your abilities sooner for an important portion of the game. Late-game the extra thac0 does not matter much anymore since you can buff a whole lot better (and your gear gets a whole lot better).

[Clown]

Your points all make sense and I'm sure your party will do very well.

The only issue I will stress one more time is that a sorcerer will give you so much of an easier time than either Jan or Nalia. Getting hold of certain scrolls especially of the new spells is really tough in v6. Without a sorcerer your going to struggle to get those spells as early as your going to want them and with three mages it may be very late game before they get these spells if at all.

Personally I think thieving skills are mostly pointless in IA however if your still realy keen on having that covered Raven had a lot of good things to say about the newly improved swashbuckler kit. It apparently was able to keep up more or less with his warriors in terms of late game melee power in addition to its striking AC defense.

Also another thing which came to mind is the undead hunter for one of your melee options, this kit could come in real handy against some of the newe improvments.

Just another option to consider.

[darkjeshush]

I think Valygar will become a staple character in v6, so instead of 1-2 clerics, you can probably reduce that to 0.5. Therefore, R/C will become the best divine choice for v6. Valygar's extra cure serious wounds and mass cures will supplement your 1/2 healer early on, and his anti confusion spell (I forgot what it was called) will be invaluable.

This lineup would be pretty pro for a first run.

Necromancer
Valygar
Nalia -> Imoen
Riskbreaker
F/I (or F-M)
R/C

Second run

Vagrant
Valygar
Nalia -> Imoen
F/I
B-M
R/C

And then more creative builds beyond 2nd playthrough

[lroumen]

I don't really know the latest abilities for the protector kit, but yes, it does seem that we can cut down on the clerical spells early-game since potions will get you far too. In some late battles I'm guessing that you will need greater restoration.
It seems that we are all pretty much thinking alike in what is required for v6.

I'm a little sad to see it postponed to february, but in the meantime I can finish my last v5 party: Riskbreaker-Undeadhunter-Imoen-F/T-R/C-Nalia

[lroumen]

Uhm. I had a stupid realisation. Level 7 fighter gives you 1/2 attack per round... level 13 gives you another 1/2 attack per round, correct? So now I understand why level 13 could be attractive.

[darkjeshush]

lol I knew about the 1/2 attack at 13 but not about the one 7.

Has anyone ever posted an amended level progression document? You know how Sikret includes the level progression tables and item components etc in a notepad file with the download?

I was wondering if anyone has ever created a new game with F/D M/T and R/C just to clua them to 40/40 and write down all the level up bonuses. Then make a notepad chart, send to Sikret, and suggest he include it with the download. I guess maybe it would be cheesy to be able to plan ahead with so little effort? What do you think?

My speculation is that most players start out too hands-on to care about stuff like that; then as they get repeatedly owned, they become more analytical when they're forced to figure out why their vanilla party is failing so epicly.

[lroumen]

You can find everything in the 2da files, but some stuff is a bit hidden unless you know how to read it all... I was looking around in the tables a few days ago and at that point I figured out that level 13 gave the +1/2 attack bonus.

[lroumen]

I keep making changes to my plan. Not good, but okay..

1. Necromancer
2. Protector (Valygar)
3. Thief 9 -> Fighter
4. Ranger/Cleric
5. Auramaster (Cernd)
6. Bezerker -> Mage

Necromancer will be a spellslinger in the backline.
Protector will be determined when every ability is known, but it will be a good damage dealer I assume.
The thief->fighter dual will allow x4 backstab and weapon grandmastery. Melee in the midline or frontline if no thieving is required (armorchange+backstab through spell or potion).
Bezerker->mage will wield two-handers and is a secondary mage. Buffed tank in many places where necessary. Probably starts owning the frontline once some important buffs are available.
Ranger/cleric helps the healing and buffing, and will probably melee in the backline.
Cernd will be a great mage backup.

4 melee capable (T->F, R/C, B->M, Protector)
2 arcane (Necro + B->M)
1 clerical and druidic (R/C)
1 druidic and arcane (auramaster)
1 thief with general purposes (T->F)

Does level 1 NPCs work with IA? Install beforehand or afterwards?

[Hideous the W...]

Here's what I'm considering for v6 -

Sorceror or Necromancer Protagonist
F/M/T - thief that can do it all.
Mage immediate dual to Cleric - healer/spellcaster
Undead Hunter - always wanted to try a paladin in IA. Improved vamps scare me enough to try now.
Valygar - never really used him, I think I'll try.
Riskbreaker - used once in v5 and thought they were awesome, now they're slightly better!

In my v5 runs I've always sold all but a few types of scrolls instead of using them. That's why I'm considering the F/M/T and Mage>Cleric as my backup spellcasters, using scrolls whenever I can. So will v6 still have plenty of scrolls about? Does it seem like a bad idea taking a M>Cleric?

Thanks