Misc. Questions on Difficulty, Party Composition, and Spell Selection Options

[Sikret]

Yes.

[Shaitan]

[Toxeus]

Tell me please about difficulty of IA vs Tactics/Battles/Ascension (btw, do i need to install any tactical mod with IA?)
And what if i want fair play? I mean i don't like wear multiply protection items, use un-nerfed tables, cheesy weapons and whatever - will i still be able to play and enjoy Improved Anvil?
P.S. Of course, my party will be well balanced and i'm rather a good tactician

This post has been edited by Toxeus: Apr 12 2007, 09:39 AM

[Rhed]

Tell me please about difficulty of IA vs Tactics/Battles/Ascension (btw, do i need to install any tactical mod with IA?)
And what if i want fair play? I mean i don't like wear multiply protection items, use Un-Nerfed tables, cheesy weapons and whatever - will i still be able to play and enjoy Improved Anvil?
P.S. Of course, my party will be well balanced and i'm rather a good tactic ;D

The new battles are very challenging! Whether they are more or less challenging than other mods, I'm not sure. You can install the components of other mods that don't conflict with IA in addition to IA, although this is not required. There's a list of the ones that will conflict in the IA installation readme. Basically, you shouldn't install any mod that modifies a battle that is also modified by IA. Also, make sure you install IA after all other mods, that will reduce the chance of any problems occuring.

I think that Sikret intended that the un-nerfed tables, xp cap remover etc. be used, possibly to somewhat balance out the increased difficulty of IA and create an overall more epic experience. As such, you shouldn't feel as though such mods are cheesy - you'll still experience plenty of tactical challenge anyway.

[thetruth]

Tell me please about difficulty of IA vs Tactics/Battles/Ascension (btw, do i need to install any tactical mod with IA?)

Improved Anvil is IMO more difficult than Tactics and the other similar mods.
Some of the ToB encounters are at the level of Ascension when played on insane and a few of them maybe even harder.

And what if i want fair play? I mean i don't like wear multiply protection items, use un-nerfed tables, cheesy weapons and whatever - will i still be able to play and enjoy Improved Anvil?

You will.

While testing IA I had only the mod and the multiple Strongholds components from EoU installed (for testing purposes).
Also I didn't use any weapon/item out of the original game and still I enjoyed much my game (though some battles are much more difficult without the weapons added by IA).

BTW Sikret recommends the use of Magic Armor+Rings as well as the use of the unnerfed tables for your game to be fair (since some of the enemies use them as well).

Also personally I would recommend the use of the True Grandmastery patch which again makes the game more fair (the Fighter class should have sthg special in comparison to Rangers and Paladins). And of course it restores the GM like it was in BG1 and according to the 2e rules.

[Shaitan]

Can't you bring us some insight info, such as how many items has been randomized

[thetruth]

Can't you bring us some insight info, such as how many items has been randomized

To be honest I don't even know the exact number since from the time I started testing the mod until it was finished, Sikret added more items in this list.
But they are many.

And better to not spoil anything.
IMO it is one of the best new features of the mod and you will like better the surprise effect (though I must say that it does the game even more difficult).

[Shaitan]

Yes I suspect it may make the game no easier. The surprise will be there no matter what - it's random.

I hope we all will be glad with IA4.

[Sikret]

Also personally I would recommend the use of the True Grandmastery patch which again makes the game more fair (the Fighter class should have sthg special in comparison to Rangers and Paladins). And of course it restores the GM like it was in BG1 and according to the 2e rules.

Yes, True Grandmastery is also recommended in the mod's readme (though Multi-class grandmastery is not recommended).

[Sikret]

The new battles are very challenging! Whether they are more or less challenging than other mods, I'm not sure. You can install the components of other mods that don't conflict with IA in addition to IA, although this is not required. There's a list of the ones that will conflict in the IA installation readme. Basically, you shouldn't install any mod that modifies a battle that is also modified by IA. Also, make sure you install IA after all other mods, that will reduce the chance of any problems occuring.

I think that Sikret intended that the un-nerfed tables, xp cap remover etc. be used, possibly to somewhat balance out the increased difficulty of IA and create an overall more epic experience. As such, you shouldn't feel as though such mods are cheesy - you'll still experience plenty of tactical challenge anyway.

Thank you very much, Rhed! You explained things better than I could.

[nataben1314]

I'm back with a couple questions before I get to finally begin my IA adventure this weekend!

So I have five of my party members figured out, and was just looking into input as to what would probably be the best sort of 6th character to have. I'm not interested too much in NPCs, so this will be (like the rest of my party) a player-created character. Note that I'm not really worried about the lack of a thief, unless someone can specifically tell me that they are super-crucial moreso in IA than in normal BG. So far I have:

1. Ranger/Cleric
2. Berserker
3. Inquisitor
4. Auramaster
5. Fighter/Mage

So who should I get as a 6th? pureclass cleric? blade? pure mage? mage/cleric? swashbuckler? something else? I'm open to any suggestion (that is not a dual-class, it must be single or multiclass) and am concerned exclusively with power. I'm one of those people who finds tactics mod impossible, so I feel like I'll need all the help I can get

Final question. I don't have a ton of time to devote to BG (or leisure activity in general!), at least for the next couple months. So choice of protagonist is reallly a big deal for me, as it will be a very long time before I can do another run. Of course, I've narrowed it down to either my ranger/cleric or my fighter/mage, so that I can take advantage of all the new content. Which of these two (mage or ranger) would you say has the MOST new content?

[coaster]

Seems a bit underpowered on the arcane magic front to me, because if your F/M is a dual, you will have no mage for a while (unless you dual early) and if they are a multi, you will gain spells relatively slowly. But I like mages so that is just my personal view.

I guess it is also possible that the auramaster will compensate for the above because of their access to some arcane spells (or spells which are similar to arcane equivalents such as aura cleansing). I haven't tried auramaster though so I can't give a proper view on this question.

I'm playing with a wild mage protagonist for the first time, since I read comments (Sikret's I think) that they are potentially more powerful than sorcerors (on average - it depends if Nahal's Reckless Dweomer fires off those 9th level spells successfully).

[Sikret]

Note that I'm not really worried about the lack of a thief, unless someone can specifically tell me that they are super-crucial moreso in IA than in normal BG.

No, having a thief in your party is not crucial (not at least more than it is in the original game), but perhaps having a dual-class Swashbuckler-Mage will be a good idea. In this way, you will have the minimum required theiving skills plus a mage to compensate the lack of Arcane magic in your party. thetruth and others may also give you good suggestions. To some extent, it also depends on your playing style.



As for not having Bioware NPCs in your party and create player-made characters, it surely has the advantage of having characters with better stats, but on the other hand you won't be able to b enefit from the specific item upgrades each of those NPCs have. At least, instead of your custom Auramaster, I can suggest to take Cernd in your party. You will be able to upgrade his Cloak and Staff.

Final question. I don't have a ton of time to devote to BG (or leisure activity in general!), at least for the next couple months. So choice of protagonist is reallly a big deal for me, as it will be a very long time before I can do another run. Of course, I've narrowed it down to either my ranger/cleric or my fighter/mage, so that I can take advantage of all the new content. Which of these two (mage or ranger) would you say has the MOST new content?

It's a very difficult question, because both (mage and ranger strongholds) have good amounts of new content added to them. But if you force me to give one single recommendation between the two, then I will tell you to go for the ranger.

[thetruth]

@nataben1314


First of all IIRC you don't like much pure Arcane spellcasters (like me) and even if it's true that in IA4 the offensive power of Mages has been limited, only a F/M is not enough to cover your party's needs.

You will need another Mage mainly for buffs like I.Haste (the most useful spell in IA IMO), summons and debuffing spells.
Your F/M will not have enough 6 level spells since in some battles PfMWs will be essential like I.Haste is.

For me the best solution is to dual your Berserker immediately to Mage (at level 7). This way you will not miss at all Arcane spells since he will level up quickly.

For the 6th place I would take a F/T or a pure Swashbuckler (UAI as first HLA, then some Timetraps and GWW OR WW attacks - other traps are useless in IA).
This way you will not miss any melee power.

Thieves are not essential in IA but a F/T or a Swashie are much more than a simple Thief

As about your protagonist, both Rangers and Mages get additional quests in IA.
Power-wise the F/M is better and if played correctly he will win many difficult battles by himself.
But the R/C is one of the most powerful classes as well, so both of them are a good choice for your PC.

I'm playing with a wild mage protagonist for the first time, since I read comments (Sikret's I think) that they are potentially more powerful than sorcerors (on average - it depends if Nahal's Reckless Dweomer fires off those 9th level spells successfully).

The Wild Mage is the most powerful class in the original game or in a game with other tactical mods (Tactics,Ascension), BUT not in IA4 where the F/M is even more powerful IMO.

As about Wild Surges a high level Wild Mage can eliminate them with 3xImproved Chaos Shield in a CC, though I wouldn't recommend it.
At high levels you get more positive W.Surges than negative and besides it is one of the things that makes the W.Mages so special and fun to play with.

[coaster]

thetruth - yes, it is the combination of power and fun which is so enjoyable. I try not to reload for most wild surges, good or bad (although I do for the one which changes my sex )

[nataben1314]

sikret:

excellent, thanks! I will use my R/C for my protagonist then.

thetruth:

What makes the f/t or swashy so good? I mean I know they can backstab but other than that what distinguishes them from a fighter? I confess that I don't think I get the maximum use out of UAI. What's so good about it? What about instead of a swashy maybe being a bountyhunter? I read somewhere that high level bountyhunters have a throwable area of effect maze trap with a significant save penalty attached. Is that true? Would it be effective in IA? Maybe like a fighter dualed to a bountyhunter? Oh and what all is entailed with dualing the berserker to mage? Do I just have to make sure int is 16 or above? Should I dual him immediately, like right at the very beginning of irenicus' dungeon?

thanks guys!

[Mongerman]

Generally, the levels to duel are

lvl 7 - basic berserker abilities and thaco, regain mage abilities faster
lvl 9 - extra attack per round, more thaco and hitpoints
lvl 13 - max attacks per round, but regaining mage abilities will be VERY tedious if you dont use cheese.

You need 15 in str and 17 in int to duel if I'm not mistaken.

I believe thetruth was comparing a f/t to a thief rather then a fighter. A pure thief has too many skill points by mid game, so you might as well give him some fighter abilities. Based on my past experiences, while vanilla thieves were good in unmodded BG (cheesey traps and massive backstab), they are a deadweight in IA

This post has been edited by Mongerman: Apr 20 2007, 12:16 AM

[thetruth]

What makes the f/t or swashy so good? I mean I know they can backstab but other than that what distinguishes them from a fighter? I confess that I don't think I get the maximum use out of UAI. What's so good about it?

F/T at high levels is like a Fighter with thieving skills.
Same THACO (missing only 1 ApR if you use the Grand Mastery patch).

With UAI you can use:

- weapons, like the Scarlet Ninja-To (+1 ApR) or the Carsomyr
- items, like Jan's armor (+ DoEastheaven, Hardiness, Gromnir's helm for 85% res. to physical dmg and immunity to crushing)
- scrolls (having a secondary F/M is always useful in the really tough battles)

Timetraps:

In the SoA part of the game are extremely useful. Pick some of them right after UAI and before GWWs.
10 ApR (dualwielding Belm,Kundane or Scarlet + I.Haste) with the time stopped


Swashbuckler:

He reaches his true power in ToB levels.
- 24 permanent AC + UAI + WWs + Timetraps and with a Fighter's THACO and big bonus to damage.

His AC is effective even against the very powerful enemies of IA.
In a small party he would be even more effective (higher levels in the SoA part of the game)

What about instead of a swashy maybe being a bountyhunter? I read somewhere that high level bountyhunters have a throwable area of effect maze trap with a significant save penalty attached. Is that true? Would it be effective in IA?

The Bounty Hunters' traps can maze the target ignoring MR and saving throws.
They can be thrown but only if the enemy is out of your visual range.

Maze traps can be a very good tactical weapon (dividing enemies), but the Bounty Hunter doesn't have the melee power of a F/T or a Swashie.

Maybe like a fighter dualed to a bountyhunter?

In BG2 you can't choose a kit for your second class.

Oh and what all is entailed with dualing the berserker to mage? Do I just have to make sure int is 16 or above? Should I dual him immediately, like right at the very beginning of irenicus' dungeon?

You need 15 in STR and 17 in INT.
Mongerman wrote the best levels for dual-classing (though you gain 1/2 ApR at 7 level and another 1/2 at 13).

The best (power-wise) level for dualclass is the 13 level, but in this case you want him mainly as a Mage.
So if you dual class at 7 level he will level up so fast that you won't miss at all any Mage spells.

Just remember to take Grand Mastery in a 1-handed weapon.Even better if you have the True Grandmastery patch (Ease of Use).
The B-M will be very effective with Timestop + I.Haste + dual wielding.

[nataben1314]

Excellent, thanks! I think I'll go with a Swashie, because I prefer single class and I have never tried one before.

Be prepared for a "HELP ME!!!!" thread or two over the next few months . Your comment about some battles being harder than ascension on insane is really scary! Does that include oversight's improved sendai on insane, and the final battle of ascension on insane?? Because from what I hear those battles are like most insanely cheesy craziness ever. I'm scared!

[thetruth]

Your comment about some battles being harder than ascension on insane is really scary! Does that include oversight's improved sendai on insane, and the final battle of ascension on insane??

Not all of them but let's say that the most difficult battles of IA are at the level of Ascesnion on insane.

Improved Sendai is not so difficult on insane if you have a party.
Well at least less difficult than soloing it with some classes .