A new 9th level spell, It has enough space for several suggestions Options

[Sikret]

I'm thinking on making another new necromantic spell, and a 9th level one this time.

By casting this spell, The mage manipulates his force of life to create a powerful effect, but the outcome will be random. In other words, each time this spell is cast one (and only one) effect randomly picked from a pool will take effect and the result will not be predictable.

I need your suggestions for these possible random effects. Since the effects are random, it has enough room for several different effects.

The spell is 9th level, so feel free to be generous in what you suggest (as long as they are not insanely overpowered). The randomness of the outcome also makes it plausible to have a few powerful effects among several ordinary ones.

Don't suggest things which clearly contradict with the spell's school (= necromancy). For example, a random effect which creates illusions or makes the mage invisible is not plausible.

I probably prefer the spell to affect no other creature than the caster (to be cast only on 'self') though I have not yet made my mind about this particular point with 100% certainty and I'm open to suggestions to change it. I think that confining the spell to be targeted at 'self' will probably make the spell's design easier; otherwise, we may have to worry about various other elements (what will happen if the spell is cast on an enemy? What if it is cast on a neutral commener or on a summoned creature and this or that random effect appears?); on the other hand, confining the spell to affect the caster will rule out some effects (for example an effect to cure stun will be out of question, because if the caster is already stunned, he can't cast the spell).

The spell's randomness makes it somewhat similar to "wish" spell; so, the two spells shouldn't have similar random effects. A mage can know and use both. None of the two spells should make the other one redundant.

[Ymarsakar]

Energy Drain is pretty weak and useless. I don't think anybody used it even in vanilla except if they thought using the other 9th level spells were too cheesy or over powered.

Given time stop, black blade of disaster for F dual Ms, and improved alacrity, Energy Drain, which removes 2 levels of experience, is just not in the same league as Spellstrike and the others mentioned above.

As for the new spell's effects, it might be a nice idea to go with the theme set by the mage robe in The Four mod. Meaning, have one of the effects be to remove all spell protections from the caster, with an additional 100% spell failure applied for 1-3 rounds, and in return the caster might get damage immunities or the caster might drain the level of a nearby creature via bypassing magic resistances but not magic protections.

[Clown]

I like the sound of this spell very much, however I have struggled to think of many appropriate effects. These are the only ones I can think of so far:

1. Summon Greater Undead, raises a skeleton lord to fight for the caster.
1(a). Summon Spirit, the spell calls forth a powerful ancestor spirit to fight at the casters side( this option is in case a skeleton lord is too powerful or to make the summon a little more interesting).

2. Damage Undead(needs a better name), will cause 6D10 damage to all lesser undead, 3D10 damage to skeleton warriors, Skeleton lords and vampires, 2D6 damage to all liches, skeleton grandlords, vampire lords and other greater undead. Roughly same area of effect as Cleric turning. The damage levels are rough guesses and probably need work.

3. Raise allies, casts ressurection on all party members. This is much like the resting wish spell option but with the disadvantage of not getting abilities back but the advantage that it will raise all party memebers at full health.

4. Raise Undead Horde, raises corpse that have lain buried beneath the battle field for years to fight once again, this spell summons D3+2 undead creatures to fight by the casters side. To represent the random nature of this spell undead versions of any creatures you might encounter during the game can be summoned by this spell eg. undead gibberlings to undead minataurs. Alternatively the type of undead could depend upon the map on which it is cast for example undead drow and umberhulks in the under dark to represent the fact that the spell just raises corpses from the ground around them.
4(a). Raise Undead Horde, If the above idea is a bit overly complex then simply summon d3+1 skeleton warriors instead as the undead horde.

5. Summon Item X, On the casting of this spell a powerful item is drawn into existence and appears in the casters pack. This item is a useful upgrade component which will be used as part of an upgrade recipe. Personally I was thinking as a part of the recipe for a new improved mace of disruption, turning it back into a top notch undead killer as its current +2 status hamstrings it somewhat.

I know these ideas are maybe not the best but I hope some are at least interesting, I look forward to seeing what everyone else comes up with.

This post has been edited by Clown: Jun 1 2008, 10:34 AM

[lroumen]

It's easier to come up with beneficial area effects than beneficial caster only effects. To limit this you can simply restrict the effects to a 30 foot radius around the caster or such. Some ideas:

- Summon a 1-2 Skeleton Grandlords
- Charm Undead in 30 foot radius around caster (save vs spells at -X)
- Vampiric Touch on hostile creatures in 30 foot radius around caster (1d6 damage /2 caster lvls, lvlmax=20)
- Fear Aura around caster (30 foot radius, save at -X or flee/panic for 2 rounds)
- Decrepify (disease+poison) on hostile creatures in 30 foot radius around caster (Disease: slow for 4 rounds, 1 damage/second for 4 rounds, save to negate slow and half damage. Poison: 2 damage/second for 4 rounds save vs poison to negate)
- Inflict Serious Wounds on hostile creatures in 30 foot radius around caster

[Sikret]

Thanks all!

Please keep sending ideas. As I said, the spell has enough space for several random effects. I will think about the suggestions and will gradually edit my original post and will add those suggestions which I have liked most to it (perhaps with some minor modifications).

Also, think to find an appropriate name for the new spell.

@Clown

2. Damage Undead(needs a better name), will cause 6D10 damage to all lesser undead, 3D10 damage to skeleton warriors, Skeleton lords and vampires, 2D6 damage to all liches, skeleton grandlords, vampire lords and other greater undead. Roughly same area of effect as Cleric turning. The damage levels are rough guesses and probably need work.

IA v6 already includes a new 7th level spell which does this:

Disrupt Undead (Necromancy)
Level: 7
Range: Touch
Duration: Instantaneous
Casting Time: 7
Area of Effect: One Undead Creature
Saving Throw: None

By means of this powerful spell, the mage uses his powerful necromantic touch to disturb the negative forces floating inside an undead creature. The spell bypasses the target's magic resistance (if any) and inflicts a huge amount of damage, which varies depending on the udead type:

- Skeleton Lords (and lesser undead creatures): 10D6
- Skeleton Warlords: 8D6
- Skeleton Grandlords: 6D6
- Liches, Master Vampires and Vampire Lords: 5D6

[Clown]

@Sikret

I remembered discusion of that spell but wasn't sure whether it had been implemented or not. The fact that it has been obviously makes my version redundant but it might be an idea to possibly have one of the effects of the new spell to be an area of effect version of the new spell. This is potentially immensly powerful however it is a level nine spell and as you mentioned in your first post a randomly generated effect.

[lroumen]

You mean like Sunfire?

[Clown]

Yes, something like sunfire except it would only effect undead.

[lroumen]

Sunfire is already very imbalanced on undead, although I do not know how it fares against the Undead added by IA (haven't really gotten that far due to a lack of time).

[Shadan]

My ideas (including some former ideas, but explained):

1. 1 or more summoned mobs. At higher level only Mordi Swords, Planetars-Devas, elemental prines, Vagrant summons, noble spider, noble efreeti the only usefull summons. Even juggernaut golem or berserker from Valhalla horn are weak. What else all summons except noble efreeti and swanmay queen are weak in high end game. I found Summon Planetar as a weak lvl 9 spells, and if we do better summons then we should buff celestials and elemental pirnces also with some improvements.

2. Somekind of Vampiric Touch style AE against undeads, as others mentioned it. Pls note that Sunfire is not good against most of the improved undeads, since they are mostly immune to fire.

3. Some kind of damage reduction + immunities. Like skeleton lord form (immune to piercing, 75% resistance to slashing, no bonus against bludgeoning, 90 % MR, immune to imprisonment etc.). I don't know if it is possible or not, but it would be great if in the text window the source of damage would be writed also, like fire, slashing etc. It would help to make strategy when source is not so easy as the fireball...

4. Another form like vampire lord form: very high regeneration, immune to cold and electricity.

These forms could maybe applied to whole party for short time a'la Hardiness from Wish or longer duration but self only.

I like AE Energy drain. This spell should subtitue the old Energy Drain spell. AE fear and disease+poison is good also, but these should skip MR and no or -4-6 to saves otherwise they should be useless as level 9 spell.

I don't support the "summon item" idea, since that is a conjuration spell, not necro.

[Sikret]

Thanks again for all of your suggestions.

Let me now add some more limitations for the kind of effects I am looking for:

I decided not to give any offensive/damaging effects to the spell. No summoning or item creation or animate dead effects will also be included. I have also made the spell's icon a blue one, which will indicate the spell's defensive/protective nature.

The spell will also have 3 fixed (not random) effects which will apply each time the spell is cast. One of them is a negative side effect; the other two are a positve effects:

(I) Each time the spell is cast, it will dispel all illusionary effects (invisibility, mirror image and et al) from the entire party (the idea is based on the fact that the illusion school is the opposite school of necromancy)

(II) The spell will grant 12 temporary hit points to all party members (the extra hp will remain for 10 rounds and won't be dispellable).

(III) The spell removes all disabling effects from the entire party.

Some random effects which have occurred to me (some of which are based on some of your suggested ideas) are theese (feel free to comment on them or add/suggest new effects):

1- Cure Disease, Poison and level drain and resistance to those effects for 5 rounds (on party; not dispellable)

2- Heal on the entire party

3- Regeneraion (as per the 7th level clerical spell) for 10 rounds (on party; not dispellable; can cumulatively stack if you are lucky to gain the same random effect)

4- 20% resistance to physical damage for 5 rounds (only on the caster; not dispellable; can cumulatively stack if you are lucky to gain the same random effect; the effect has a short duration so we have no worry to let it stack with hardiness, armor of faith and potions of Barbarian Essence)

5- +4 bonus to THAC0 plus Improved haste for 10 rounds (only on the caster; dispellable)

6- Mental agility (+1 bonus to casting speed) for 5 rounds (only on the caster, not dispellable; can stack with the 8th level spell 'Foreknowledge')

7- 100% resistance to Cold and Magic damage for 5 rounds (on party; dispellable)

8- No effect except the 2 fixed ones.

The spell still has plenty of free slots for more random effects; so feel free to suggest more. If you can think of any other appropriate fixed (negative or positive) effect, suggest it too.

This post has been edited by Sikret: Jun 9 2008, 11:49 AM

[Ryel ril Ers]

Hi again!

-Soulchain: if the caster get x damage then he get instead 0 damage but every other party member get x/(n-1) damage (round down!!!) where n the number of party.

Example the caster get 34 damage and the party is contains 6 character, then the caster get 0 damage and every other party member get 34/5 = 6.8 ~ 6 damage

-Warden souls: all member of the party get +2 bonus to their saves and x% MR where x is the caster's level

-Pain reflection: every enemy who hurt any member of the party physically get 5 magic damage or 30% of the caused damage (it counted after the resists)
IMPORTANT: the counterstrike only happens if the party member get at least 1 damage.

[lroumen]

I'm not too certain about the resistance bonuses (nr2 and 7). That sounds too much like Abjuration to me. The other suggestions seem to fit into the necromancer synopsis (although nr 5 and 8 a bit less so).

Maybe this can give you some more ideas. Sadly most are summoning or damage related spells (especiall negative energy).

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Necromancer_(DnD_Class)

This post has been edited by lroumen: Jun 3 2008, 10:57 PM

[coineineagh]

Here's an idea:
What about making it a bit like the wish spell? Instead of summoning a djinn you get a lich, and he works for you not against you... you get random choices selected from the earlier ideas, but there's a chance of it failing (because although you order the lich to alter realities, it's slightly beyond his capabilities), resulting in the wrong effect, or maybe a wild surge?
It's a bit more complicated to pull off, but I'd use this kind of spell, not one with random effects.

[Exor]

How about a protection from undead - scroll effect for ... 3 rounds?


Or... gain 10 maxhp for every undead in sight & -5 maxhp for every living in sight


Or... summons a Skeleton lord for every dead party member


mostly I want those snazzy skeleton lords to fight for me once^^


This post has been edited by Exor: Jun 8 2008, 08:04 PM

[Arkain]

Mhm... maybe "Life Force Projection" or something like that as a name? Given that it seems to be a spell which manipulates one's life force to achieve various effects the name may be fitting.

It might also be interesting to delve a bit further into that idea a bit further, maybe in the form of stronger effects (on the caster?) but also some drawbacks for the caster when the spell's duration ends. For example fatigue and a 25% chance to miscast magic for two rounds to illustrate how exhausting the spell is for the caster.

[Sikret]

Mhm... maybe "Life Force Projection" or something like that as a name? Given that it seems to be a spell which manipulates one's life force to achieve various effects the name may be fitting.

Yes, I was actually thinking of "Recast Vital Energy" as the spell's name, but your suggestion is nice too. I welcome more suggestions.

[Sikret]

mostly I want those snazzy skeleton lords to fight for me once^^

Granted!

You will probably have your allied Skeleton Lord, though not by means of the particular spell we are discussing here. It should be something very specifically usable by necromancers only.

I'm thinking of making Amulet of Hades upgradable one more step into the ultimate amulet for your necromancer protagonist if you play one. I will probably call the amulet "Lord of the underworld" or something like that (any suggestions?) and will add the ability to summon a Skeleton Lord to it. Naturally, the item will be very difficult to forge.

[Sikret]

Here is another gift to those who are so eagerly looking for being able to summon allied Skeleton lords:

In addition to what I wrote in my previous post about the amulet, I also made this new 9th level spell in a way that if cast by a necromancer, it will have a chance to summon a skeleton lord to fight at your side.

[Kerkes]

How about this - clerics have mass raise dead, no? give this to necromancer mages - but they raise som kind of improved skeletons , or a damaging single target spell called bone growth - deals 5d4 piercing per round, bypass MR, for 5 rounds or so.
Or a buffing spell - cold bones - raises the target's damage resistance by 15 percent, cumulative with hardiness, cold res + 15, lower fire res by 30 percent or, eve better, sets to zero
Solo buffing - death aura - immunity to necromancy, but not considerd as spell immunity, can't be dispelled, 4 rounds lasting, can't be recast like spell shield)
death vapors - slows enemies for 2 rounds, no save, bypass MR