I definitly think you should start a specific thread, this is starting to be too confusing. You change too much hypotesys too often, and all you talk about is cheesy/tricky and not at all the way mod should be played. This is designed to be done late SoA at level 20-25, at first you say do it at level 36. Old one fight is designed to be a fight where protag saves old one and now you propose to kill old one...
When I ask you some details about the fight, you answer with another change of how it was handled (Necro level 31 then 36, then killing old one,...)
You pretend to have a no-reload tactic working fine, but only things you describe with detail is how to cast spell cheesily (alacrity during old one talk) or have grave wasting a round removing/re-equipping hades, this is leading nowhere for someone trying to play the mod according to its design and even for someone trying to play it your way.

Players and newcomers reading this thread will understand nothing (all the more if they read journal).

I sincerely doubt it is possible to win the fight as you described it, but I might be wrong, will see that on the video (btw it looks more tedious to me to make a video than a record, and records of this fight I made a lot), but please do separate this from initial topic

To admin: is it possible to split all exchanges about "old one fight with chees and exploit" on a specific thread?

No problem, I don't mind even if my posts are deleted or anything, I myself cannot transfer them to a new topic obviously Will post the video(s) link(s) in another thread, named aptly.

I will reward one Tactical Reputation point to the first person who explains and gives the best answer why "Spell Immunity: Necromancy" is a better choice than "Spell Immunity: Abjuration" during the battle in which the necromancer protagonist helps The Old One against three Grave Liches.

@nicoper:

I am currently uploading a video in which a solo 36 level Necromancer kills the Old One and the three Grave Liches afterwards. Since it may be in contradiction with Sikret's wish not to post such achievements here, I am sending the links to you in a PM. There is also a little bit included in the end which shows that Potion of Freedom effect is in fact not removed by Breach spell. Generally, similar effects that come from spells and scrolls are Breach-able, but this one isn't. That's why you should first test stuff like that before assuming it won't work - there are still many such surprises hidden throughout the game.

I have fought that same battle with the equivalent of a 25-lvl mage right now. This means: no Remove Magic, less spell slots, but with the same 36 lvl character, running SI:Abjuration, I don't have any savegames with that low-level character nearby, sorry, have to play a lot to get there anew. BTW did you notice that Pierce Magic's casting time is somewhat lower than 6? It can be cast instantly with reduced casting time of 4, which means it's either 3 or 4 actually. This makes it better (compared to Pierce Shield) to dispel refreshed enemy Spell Turning when PC is under Alacrity effect.
That battle was also won, but all kills were stolen by the Old One.

However I personally fail to see why SI: Necromancy is better in this fight. If PC keeps SI:A and Spell Turning active the whole time, (s)he is far better protected vs enemy's offensive spells. Will eventually post that video link as well to make my point.

After installing the original version of IA v6 you downloaded from this site, you will have to start a new game to let all changes take effect. Loading a saved game you had from the beta will not do.

Got it, will do. Then I am afraid nicoper would have to wait a bit longer for that video(s).

Edit: Just a question: If I import and start a new game with a greatly experienced party, and I wanna do that to progress to the Old One fight as fast as I can, will that result in any particular changes specifically for the Old One fight?

This post has been edited by Krell: Apr 25 2013, 06:10 PM

You will probably miss out on some content, such as the Screaming Statue encounter, the Spellhold will be improved, some battles will have tougher versions of opponents, but none of it will matter for a near-EDE party, in terms of experience.

@krell: I will wait as long as needed to see the video, no problem, I promise I will comment it there (I owe this to you)



Please, focus on something; start a new game , play it according to your standard, if some exploit you usually use axist no more use clua to get more xp, take as much time as you need.
No need to add other exploit or cheese to the ones you already mentioned (for example I Wonder what would be the result to import a 40/40/40 FMC, sure something strange and/or buggy...)

LOL. People who are addicted to using exploits typically can't play the game in the honest way anymore. They get used to super strong characters (he even said he wanted to switch alignment in the middle of the game to get both good-aligned stuff and Evil-aligned robe from "The Four" mod)

Ah, I see now what you mean. I do not agree with you, this one is cheating:



But to be honest that is not fair to call this run no-reload insane run. The proper name is no-reload insane run with unlimited gold and max. leveled characters. Also, if you name it this way then it is not cheating anymore because under this condition it is not against the rule you setup. But then I do not understand why you use expoits, it is much more easier and way more hones to use cluaconsole commands and give your party 10 million gold and 10 million XP to all of your chars. This way you do not waste time on the boring gold or XP mining.

So, my statement is still valid I think. In a normal run where you do not use XP or gold exploits or other cheats IA insane non-reload run is practically impossible. I mean of course there is a very slight chance that someone can do it but when someone says it is doable then it means you have a very good chance to do it. And in IA there are a lot of fights where your life depends on pure luck. One very simple example is Suna Seni.

This post has been edited by Vuki: Apr 25 2013, 09:32 PM

Hm, I have my own thoughts about playing the game and winning it on Core difficulty and with multiple reloads. But to each his own. Anyway, aside from that, I started a fresh game, and decided to play with only in-game NPCs - no pregenerated ones. So far I noticed no differences at all - same early xp and gold exploits are available, so raising levels up to maximum is just a matter of time.

Logical conclusion would be that probably nothing significant has been changed (if any changes at all) in the Old One fight.

Also tested if Freedom potion effect is removed by Breach in the new game. No, Breach doesn't affect it.

True, using ingame exploits is not basically different from using the console. It is "cheat in disguise". The guy just fools his own conscience trying to avoid the console commands.



He is probably level 30 before meeting Suna Seni. LOL

There is a video of 2 parts which I uploaded on Youtube most recently.

How to find it:
enter www.youtube.com
In the Search field write the following string: baldur's gate 2 improved anvil v6
It's a video of 2 parts, enjoy. If you have any comments, let me know. That video is made from a game with no exploits whatsoever.

Here's my 2 cents about anyone claiming to go through IA with no reloads.

This is from one of my journals...
"I had my first reload against Thaxll'ssillyia. "

Early on it's possible to get pretty far without reloading. I would imagine being able to through the Underdark without reloading. After that there will be reloads. I usually stop counting my reloads at a certain point because 1 battle could give me fits. Say in the range of 3-6 reloads or more.

Here is where I call BS on a no-reloads game...
Getting to a certain battle, say for instance the Supreme Leader battle, and playing that battle with an imported party and figuring out enemy tactics and after several reloads implementing your strategy and then loading your "no reloads" party to use that strategy. I can't say you've done this Krell but from reading your posts I am assuming you have. To me a no reloads is taking 1 party from start to finish without practicing a battle before hand, and not using exploits. And the content of the game is so abundant by the time I get to the later stages of the game I have completely forgot what tactics some fights entail. And after years of playing the mod there are some battles which I've only played a few times.

Anyone that can do it must have notes on battles, play the game a ton and have a lot of luck on their side and even then I'd have to see it to believe it. But that's just me, and I play the game a whole lot, over and over again. And please note, I don't mind someone playing however they want to, it's your game so play however you want. The game is supposed to be fun after all.

Nicoper

Dont't bother with Krell, Saros actually... Just see his video of Aerie vs Suna Seni and his continous running in circles an you will see that he is a weak player. Exploits he talks about, a guy on Facebook told him about those, those are his own, not from a mystery stranger. A "normal" or average player, including you, given some experience with Improved Anvil, will whip Suna party far faster and easier than him.

Saros

Just drop it. You have been proving your ways for years now. Expoit the game, the engine, all of unfixable bugs, overpowered characters, but please, don't lie as much. No hard feelings, just drop it.

@Hideous
Same here, I say no-reload is BS because too many battles where impossible to have 100% winning tactic (apart ctrl-R all the way, and even so I doubt it)

@lambada
agree with you, only thing that is sad in krell/saros statements is to mislead some players or newcomers into desperatly looking for exploit/cheese when they have problem with a fight instaed of asking or finding how it could be handled normally which is much more self-rewarding. I know what I am talking about, I still remember my first 80+ reloads with Elite Bounty Huntress years ago before I understood I could use RRoR to peel her (and other way to deal with her more easily, now I consider this fight won at 99,9%)

@krell/saros
Do you just realize you spend a huge amount of RL time playing Improved Anvil in completly meaningless and tedious tasks (playing hours to raise your xp on exploits, testing so called no-reload tactics that you cannot even describe precisely, ...) while playing the game "as it should" you will have more fun and more results? As Lambada guessed, anyone playing Suna Seni normally will have a much shorter fight (with good odds no-reload with some very little experience).
You have spent days and days looking for exploits, cheese and so, but in the end what did you achieve with this?
Nonetheless, I will insist upon the fact that you should be free of speech on this forum, I am not a censor, I prefer exchanging arguments.
Only questions I ask you, knowing that Sikret is very "sensitive" to using chees/cheat/exploits, why do you taunt him with those?
why not use the thorough knowledge of exploits/cheat/cheese you have to help him develop his mod (that you should like a lot, few people I think have played IA as much RL time as you)?
I am among the many people who are a bit upset so much time was spent in IA development to counter your cheese/cheats instead of developping the mod (more quests, more fights, more intrigue...).
If you really care about being of some help for the other IA players (and I think in your way you do), think on it

@lambada: Not absolutely correct. Actually, there was one exploit given to me by someone else. Still I promised myself (that still counts as giving my word to someone you know) that I won't reveal any xp or gold exploits to Sikret.

@nicoper:

Let me remind you that it was you who wanted to see how to slay all three Grave Liches in the Old One fight in a no-reload insane tactic and it was you who requested the videos.
By the way, coincidentally those videos were ready last night but it takes me quite a lot of time to upload them, last part is currently uploading now. They will be ready for watching in an hour or so.
There is also a video showing why Spell Immunity Abjuration is actually better than Spell Immunity Necromancy even for underpowered mage (level 26 PC) vs the Grave Liches.
I am not currently discussing any of the exploits nor why the mod was so twisted or anything else. This was Sikret's choice and we all have to live with that. I myself am not happy about it either, as you can imagine.
I'm just discussing the Old One fight. And thus have completed it both ways - with an underpowered mage (lvl 26) and overpowered one (lvl 36), both using SI: Abjuration in a no-reload insane tactic. Both mages were unharmed the whole time. In the first fight the Old One stole all kills via Improved Disrupt Undead. I haven't uploaded that video yet, but if you insist on watching it, I will. In the second fight PC lvl 36 first slew the Old One, and next one by one slew all Grave Liches. Actually, I made a few mistakes in that fight, like not casting Alacrity in the end for example. Also, the fight is actually much easier if I don't intentionally kill the Old One (which I usually don't do) and have some 2nd lvl slots reserved for Resist Fear (running around Planetars are a nuisanse). Also, I came to this fight as fast as I could, meaning I skipped a lot of items and other stuff I usually get up to this point, like the Golden Spider Figurine, Adamantite Horn of Valhalla, Moon Dog/Lion figurines or even Ring of Greater Djinni Summoning or Monster Summoning lvl VII from Vaxall. So the fight was actually much harder than usual, but still that tactic is a no-reload one.

I agree with Lambada, Hideous and Nicoper. I let him say the last word (in which he even confessed he was lying so far lol) and now, I think it is best to lock this thread to prevent more misleading and false information.